Saiga 12C 922(r) compliance issues.....

[K1196A]

A letter was sent to the ATF requesting information concerning whether the Saiga 12C LEO guns required 922® parts to be transferred to civilians (or to be legal after transfer). ***Note - this letter was in reply to FACTORY Saiga 12C guns, not stateside conversions!*********

Here is the answer (along with the original letter sent to the ATF):
BATF LETTER (http://home.comcast.net/~kilo1196alpha/WEB_PICS/Saiga_12C_BATF_letter_reply.pdf)

Now you know.

[imanaknut]

I read it that you do not have to do the parts swap as long as it was imported as a marked law enforcement shotgun before the ban sunset, but if imported after the ban sunset then it needs the parts swap. The law enforcement only markings prove the date, and per the letter, are ok as is.

[lotsagas4u]

K1196A, You have done a wonderful thing here, I did not order any compliance parts for mine. It is as it came from Russia, and I have not shot it yet, thanks Doug

[K1196A]

K1196A, You have done a wonderful thing here, I did not order any compliance parts for mine. It is as it came from Russia, and I have not shot it yet, thanks Doug

i was pretty sure it would come out the way we wanted it to, which is why i wrote the letter. glad i didn't misjudge.

mine now has the upgraded IZH. grip that sorta looks like the FAL grip, with IZH. markings. I figure these are very unique guns because they now represent a very small minority of imported post '89 guns that have no 922(r) restrictions! awww yeah!!!!

[lotsagas4u]

Hey K1196A, Do you know how many really made it in the US? I have heard 100 to 150, mine also is a Hesse imported 12C. It came with an 8 and 1-5 round mags.Saiga 12C manual, cleaning kit. Wonder how guys screwed up their "original" 12C's? Thanks again, Doug

[K1196A]

i heard the same info as you on the import numbers and expect that they are fairly accurate. I also know a guy that got a Saiga 20C, which I would guess is even less common! It seems like a lot of guys are cutting their barrels down which has tempted me alot too to be honest. I'd kinda like an 18" externally threaded barrel that would take factory chokes and flash-hiders. i thought i had some flash-hiders lined up, but it looks like the deal has gone tits up!

i got the 8 rnd mag, box, sling, manual cleaning kit and rod, but got screwed out of my 5 round mag....... (actually i think these came with three mags originally -- could be wrong though).

[lotsagas4u]

I would leave it alone, keep it original. I have not even shot mine yet, is your serial close to 01433494? Thanks

[Q-gunner2]

Why does all this come up now? How come these have been for sale for the past 5 years everywhere (to my knowledge, may be longer) and this has never come up?

[K1196A]

I would leave it alone, keep it original. I have not even shot mine yet, is your serial close to 01433494? Thanks

mine is just over 300 lower serial then yours.

Why does all this come up now? How come these have been for sale for the past 5 years everywhere (to my knowledge, may be longer) and this has never come up?

because you're probably talking about the standard Saiga 12 shotgun, which had been rendered importable. maybe i'm wrong, but it sounds like you're ignorant of the distinction.
http://home.comcast.net/~kilo1196alpha/WEB_PICS/Factory_Saiga_12C.jpg

[Q-gunner2]

I am not ignorant- I should propably follow up with a curse at you, but I wont.

I just do not pay attention to Sagia. I see one in the store all the time, its been there for months, what the heck is the difference? 12 gauge semi auto with 8 round magazine, I think it has a side-folding stock. Am I missing something?

[hugegator]

The 12C is a LEO factory configuration with Russian folding stock, p-grip, everything. All other pistol grip configuration Saiga 12's were done post-ban-sunset to the stock guns with the sporter stocks and required 922r compliance. The 12C was never imported in a "sporting" configuration, hence the LEO only designation.

[K1196A]

I am not ignorant- I should propably follow up with a curse at you, but I wont.

I just do not pay attention to Sagia. I see one in the store all the time, its been there for months, what the heck is the difference? 12 gauge semi auto with 8 round magazine, I think it has a side-folding stock. Am I missing something?

why would you curse me -- all i said was that you were ignorant of the distinction -- maybe you're ignorant of "ignorant" too -- it's not an insult.

i think what you said about not paying attention to the differences clearly makes made my point -- you just didn't know what you were talking about and you didn't recoginize the difference in the two model or take note of the "Saiga 12C" versus the "Saiga 12.".

[wjm]

Josh,

Check your post on the Siaga site (http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showtopic=5414)

Led by the most obnoxious asshole of the internet (McUZI), many of the posters are convinced that the letter states that replacing foreign with US parts is required for the 12C.

I wouldn't waste your time trying to straighten them out. Funny, its those who don't have a 12C that are making the most negative noise.

Thanks for your good work.

[K1196A]

Josh,

Check your post on the Siaga site (http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?showtopic=5414)

Led by the most obnoxious asshole of the internet (McUZI), many of the posters are convinced that the letter states that replacing foreign with US parts is required for the 12C.

I wouldn't waste your time trying to straighten them out. Funny, its those who don't have a 12C that are making the most negative noise.

Thanks for your good work.

LOL!! you can lead a horse to water...........

thanks for the post -- i had forgotten to change my e-mail address there and was missing the show! :D

[K1196A]

that bvamp guy is about paranoid too. some people just will think what they will think!

[hugegator]

I quit posting over there because of Bvamp. Most of the regulars there seem to only have one Saiga and one mag and spend endless amounts of time bitching about it. For an AK site I've never seen more people totally ignorant of how these things work as well as what the laws are and still be perfectly willing to argue their ignorance for days on end. Your thread is the ultimate example of this. Occasionally you see some great conversions but most of the time it's the stupid leading the blind. Thank you for letting me rant.

[K1196A]

I quit posting over there because of Bvamp. Most of the regulars there seem to only have one Saiga and one mag and spend endless amounts of time bitching about it. For an AK site I've never seen more people totally ignorant of how these things work as well as what the laws are and still be perfectly willing to argue their ignorance for days on end. Your thread is the ultimate example of this. Occasionally you see some great conversions but most of the time it's the stupid leading the blind. Thank you for letting me rant.

that about covered it! :D

[uzitiger]

A lot of hot air has been raised about the Saiga12 shotguns. Unfortunately EAA has stopped importing the Saiga line of guns into the US. I spoke to another importer in Lousiville, Ky. and she said they'll import Saigas as soon as they get their license from Customs (hopefully soon). I would take a Saiga 12 even in a sporter configuration since I can always convert it (if I wanted to) or just enjoy it as it comes from the factory.

:dozer:

[steve465]

What is stopping the new importer from importing more Saiga 12Cs, in the newer sexier furniture/muzzle devices with threaded barrels, as LEO shotguns?

[steve465]

http://forum.saiga-12.com/uploads/post-2-1092705303.jpg
I really like the integrated front sight block/gasblock. Not sure if that's a new magwell or new magazine.