I can make an AMD Pistol, how about a UZI pistol?

[Shortstop]

If I can legally make an AK pistol from an AMD65 kit with a home-made receiver and no provision to mount a butt stock, can I legally make an Uzi pistol using one of the $200 kits and a new receiver modified to not accept a stock and a semi bolt/selector, etc?

Anybody else doing this? If not, why not?


Regards,
Shortstop

[copper]

There are some IMI receivers still available that you could use to make an UZI pistol, but you would have to weld over and modify it so that it is not possible to bolt on a stock. The only parts kits available are surplus machineguns that fire from an open bolt and can't be legally used to make a new pistol. By the time you buy the receiver, modify it, and locate the necessary semi-auto parts, you're probably going to be spending $750 or more. I think Vector Arms was selling UZI pistols and AOW's for close to that price, so I'd check their website.

[copper]

I forgot to add, the cheap Group Industries receivers you sometimes see in the Shotgun News are just the sheet metal stampings that are not complete receivers. They require a number of additional parts, trunions, sight bases, etc. welded to them to make them complete. I never tried it, but I've read it is no easy task without the special jigs to get everything lined up correctly so they would run right.

[thymer]

a

[Shortstop]

Copper, thanks for the replies.

My state doesn't allow short barrel rifles, and I can't stand the Uzi with a 16" barrel. If I bought a Vector Arms Uzi it'll have a stock, and thus be a rifle with the 16" barrel.

If I bought a parts kit and a virgin receiver, plug the rear stock attachment points, use a semi-auto bolt, and block the selector to semi only would I then have a legal (if rather large and heavy) semi Uzi pistol with a short barrel?

The cost would likely be close to the $750 or so for a new Vector, so not much of a cost savings in rolling my own, just getting away from the ugly long barrel.

Regards, Shortstop

[cbxjeff]

I wish I had talked to Copper about a year ago!

I bought 2 - UZI SMG kits and 2 - GI 80% receivers. Everything looked OK at first but recovering the trunnions and welding them on the GI wasn't going to be easy. I would had to ask a bud to do the heli-arc work (which strictly speaking is illegal).

Then I started pricing the requires U.S.A. parts required and found that these things were getting expensive. Finially I found that I could not modify the SMG bolt for semi-fire and had to buy a new bolt. I found (just as Copper said) that I could buy what I wanted from Vector for about the same money. The one thing I would have had if I continued would have been two untraceable uzi pistols. To some, that's a big deal.

I backed off and sold both kits and receivers. I'm going the AK route now.

[droog]

There is nothing illegal about having someone else do your welding for you . You just have to be there when its being done is all. Sounds stupid I know but if your present it gives the impression that you are in control of the receiver. :gaga:

[uzimon]

dont screw around with a vector jamamatic. go to a big show (like next weekend at houstons astro arena) all uzis will be about a grand-1200

[cbxjeff]

droog, surely you aren't calling the rules stupid! Ha Ha. I got my C&R a year ago and read the book. I swear it would take a lawyer and rabbi to understand that thing! Thanks for the info though. I'll keep that in mind for next time.

tx, I got (I feel) a great deal on a nib Uzi model B about a year ago. Got it home and deceided not to shoot it. I did the same thing with my first AR (nib 20th anniversary Bushy). I got a slightly used Colt from the Speedway, IN police department to shoot. Speedway IN has little call for AR action! I thought the Vector would be a good shooter but now maybe I should look for a used IMI.

Any other thoughts guys?

[copper]

I'm just throwing this out there for thought...If you happen to run across a Norinco copy of an Uzi priced low enough ($450-500), you might consider buying one of those. They are ugly finish wise and the stock that comes with them is crap, BUT THEY WORK! I bought one, removed the tack weld on the barrel nut (so I could remove the barrel for easy cleaning), replaced the stock, and refinished it with Gunkote, and it fooled several gunwise friends into thinking it was an Israeli Uzi. The parts and mags are interchangeable with the Vector and IMI guns (surplus subgun bolts and barrel parts won't fit without mods). Everybody groans when I talk about Chinese copies of guns, but in myt experience, they look like crap and shoot very well. By thw way, I sold the Norinco, but only because I got an offer I couldn't refuse.

[doubletapme]

Shortstop, if you are a proficient fabricator or have a friend willing to help you out you can do exactly as you described. And there are very cost effective ways of going about it. If not then Vector sells a mini uzi pistol that may suit your needs.

"The only parts kits available are surplus machineguns that fire from an open bolt and can't be legally used to make a new pistol."
-You can use ANY part from a suplus kit legally although a couple do require modification.

"I forgot to add, the cheap Group Industries receivers you sometimes see in the Shotgun News are just the sheet metal stampings that are not complete receivers. They require a number of additional parts, trunions, sight bases, etc. welded to them to make them complete. I never tried it, but I've read it is no easy task without the special jigs to get everything lined up correctly so they would run right."
-The Group Industries receivers work great and only cost 20 bucks. You might as well tell people to only build AKs on Bulgarian milled receivers because those cheap sheat metal stampings are not easy.

"Then I started pricing the requires U.S.A. parts required and found that these things were getting expensive."
-No US parts required in the pistol build.

I dont mean to sound as if I am flaming anyone but there were a lot of posts that were absolutely no help to shortstops objective.

Here is how I would do it.
1 Get a surplus parts kit (Make sure it includes the receiver stubs so you can salvage the subcomponents). 200.00
Sell the bolt, barrel, and folding stock to buy more ammo.
2 Get the Group industries receiver from KY imports. 20.00
3 Get the mini uzi bolt and barrel from CDNN 23.99
Investment = 243.99

-Modify receiver to mini uzi specs. You have to make four cuts vertically through the receiver and weld three pieces back. (TIG obviously preferred method) weld on subcomponents and rivet ejector in place. weld up hole in backplate to prevent stock install.
-Modify grip frame. weld in blocking bar to limit selector and drill frame pin hole from 8mm to 9mm.
-modify front trunion to mini specs.
-Shorten barrel to mini specs or to preference.
-Shorten top cover to mini specs.
-Fabricate mini striker and firing pin.
-Fabricate 9mm grip frame pin.
This build is a little higher on the dificulty scale but I think there are a lot of competent fabricators on this board that could appreciate a mini uzi pistol with a 250.00 price tag. I am going to build this weapon and post pics and dimensions when I get time. Time is my only obstacle as I am in the middle of renovating a house and building my new shop.

[droog]

Hell if its that easy I might have to start gathering up parts. For that price a guy may as well file a form 1 and make a short barreled rifle. For $200 more you would have a SBR still cheaper than you could buy a pistol from Vector.

[doubletapme]

Droog, I would not hesitate to get the mini uzi parts from CDNN. They are selling the barrel for 20.00 the bolt for 5.00 or the pair for 23.99 At that price they are almost giving them away. I dont know of anywhere you can get a chambered chrome lined 9mm barrel blank for 20.00 I picked up a couple extra for some other projects. I want to work out a AK pistol similar to the Bison. If anyone has a link to detailed pics of the Bison that wuld be much appreciated.

[copper]

I never said you couldn't build an Uzi pistol, I just said it wasn't an easy task. The bolt from CDNN looks like an open bolt from the pic, in which case you can't use it to make a pistol (No new guns that fire from an open bolt are allowed by BATF). Also, there is no extractor or firing pin/striker assembly included, and those parts will cost you at least $100-125 if you can find them. Also, removing the trunions from an Uzi surplus parts kit is very tough. The Israelis designed those Uzi's like tanks and they do not come apart easily. I tried it once, and gave up, but maybe you're more talented in that area than me. Obviously, if you are a skilled machinist and have access to a complete metal shop, you can build an Uzi pistol, or any other metal weapon on the face of the earth for that matter. I don't think you are going to be able to find all of the parts you need and put one together for less than $500, and then you're going to have quite a lot of cutting, welding, and refinishing still left to do. I wish you luck in your project, but I think it is not a cost effective project for the avereage hobby gunsmith.

[doubletapme]

Copper, It is becoming apparent from your many posts in this thread that you have absolutely no idea how to build an Uzi. How would you know if it is too difficult or too expensive for the builders on this forum.

I am trying to share information based on my experiences, not guessing, daydreaming, or something I heard from some guy. If you are an experienced fabricator or have a friend qualified to help then you can build it and it is cost effective. If someone has never built a gun, has no tools, and no friends, then please dont attempt anything other than more research and more friends. That is exactly what these boards are great for. I am working 7 days a week right now, but I would help fellow shooters any way I can. I have built 8 full size carbines on the Group Industries receivers. I have never built an Uzi pistol because it was illegal at the time. Now thanks to the sunset, many of us can build them. I expected there to be builders here who are interested in this sort of project. If not let me know so I may save my breath.

"The bolt from CDNN looks like an open bolt from the pic, in which case you can't use it to make a pistol"
-The mini uzi bolt from CDNN is a semi auto closed bolt. No mods needed. If it were a mini open bolt it would cost a LOT more. It appears to be a closed bolt to you because you are not aware that mini Uzis do not require an internal bolt guide bar.

"Also, there is no extractor or firing pin/striker assembly included, and those parts will cost you at least $100-125 if you can find them."
-The full auto extractor included in your surplus parts kit is not only interchangable, it is an upgrade from a semi auto extractor. As I stated in the first post you can make the striker assembly. If this is too much for you then buy it.

"Also, removing the trunions from an Uzi surplus parts kit is very tough."
-It is slightly more difficult than stripping AK stubs but no reason to give up on a sweet build.

"The Israelis designed those Uzi's like tanks"
-FINALLY something we agree on. your not so bad after all.

"you're going to have quite a lot of cutting, welding, and refinishing still left to do."
-Exactly, I love cutting, welding, and refinishing. If you dont then why do it?

"I don't think you are going to be able to find all of the parts you need and put one together for less than $500"
-I bought my parts kit from Sarco a year ago for 145.00 I bought the barrel and bolt from CDNN for 23.99 I bought the receiver from KY imports a year ago in quantity for 17.99 I sold the folding stock for 45.00 I sold the full auto bolt for 40.00 Therefore I have 101.98 invested. How much more cost effective can it get? Maybe we should be paid for accepting these cheap parts?


"I tried it once, and gave up"
-That is unfortunate but you must realize now that you were missing either the information, skills, tools, or assistance neccessary. Much of that information is available on boards like this if you were willing to listen.

[copper]

Thanks very much for your informed opinion. I never meant to slam you or your project, but it apparent that I pissed you off and you don't have any problem insulting me. I really hope you get your Uzi together and it works well. My intent at posting was to advise those of us who do not have access to a complete machine shop and welding tools that this is a tougher build than an AK, or FAL.

[Q-gunner2]

If you do not live in a facist state, here is what you do:

1. Buy an Uzi kit and reciever, closed bolt.
2. Get a 16" barrel.
3. Put it together.

Add the 16" barrel, THEN the stock. Legally, you did nothing wrong. If you are old enough to have the pistol, then you can have the rifle. By adding the long barrel, you have a long barreled pistol, perfectly legal, unrestricted. Add the stock and it is 100% rifle. Not restricted. Want a pistol? Take the stock off first, then take off the 16" barrel and add the 10.5" barrel.

That is the same thing Beretta is doing with the .22 Neos pistol, selling it to people who are 21 and then giving them the 16" barrel and stock so they can convert it. Some companies also did that with the Smith & Wession 76 SMG, selling it with the original barrel and the long barrel.

[droog]

There is a thread over on Uzi Talk right now with pics of a guy cutting up a GI receiver to mini specs.Pretty cool.I will start ordering parts next week.

[doubletapme]

Droog, go to uzi talk. then go down to gunsmithing and kit building forum. then go down to mini dimensions thread. Those are the dimensions you are looking for.

[droog]

Damn Uzi talk s domain expired. I hope they renew it .I forgot to make a copy of the measurements to cut the receiver to mini specs.

[doubletapme]

I made great progress on the mini uzi build this weekend. I finished everything but the refinish and the fabrication of the striker and firing pin assembly. I cant seem to post pics. is this because I dont have over 50 posts yet?

[Rom 99.1]

Hope i'm not butting in here, but thought I might ask a coulpe questions..
I have a 10 inch IMI chrome lined barrel that was made up for a SBR project that was abandoned...it was a Model B semi auto barrel...so fit's the standard semi auto carbine receiver...also have a complete IMI Model B semi auto bolt and firing assembly...left over from a Class 3 registered bolt conversion of a Model B carbine...
So, my question is...Is all I have to do to build a pistol with these parts is to get a complete semi auto receiver and lower from Vector or D&D?...a new receiver,(never been built up), get my FFL to transfer it as a pistol, have a smith weld something on the back to prevent mounting a stock... and drop the bolt and barrel in?...Am I missing something?, but this sounds like all I would have to do. Semi auto receivers are what $295...? and a lower...not too much I bet...and grips...I have an extra barrel nut...What am I missing here?
Any imput would be very welcome...I have never built anything...but have really admired you guys AK pistol builds...
Thanks,
Chris.
sandsnake@sbcglobal.net

[doubletapme]

Chris, I posted a reply to the question in your other post.

Slamfire, why cant I post pics? Do I need 50 posts first or something? Thanks, Steve