AK-103 or SLR-100H?

[Cannon Cocker]

I posted this on the General Board, but thought I might get a better response here.

I am placing an order for a new AK next week and I've narrowed my choices down to either an AK-103 or an SLR-100H. I like the idea of a milled receiver, but I like the look of the 103 and the fact it is a Russian rifle (for the most part).

Help!

[S-S-R-9-9]

Well, here is what I see as pro's for the Saiga 2: It is built using mostly real Russian parts, that may or may not actually be any better than any other former Com Bloc country, but are from the mother country of the AK. It also has all new parts. On the con side: the Saiga 2 is imported as a standard Saiga, then it's sent to a gunsmith here in the states for modifications such as, modifying it to take standard mags, placing the fire control system and trigger guard further forward. Installing unproven American parts. They must also set it up to accept traditional pistol grip stock sets. There has already been a person that posted up info of bad functioning on their new specimen. Now IMO, the SLR100H pros are: a milled Bulgarian receiver, no modifications to trigger location, no modification for magazine acceptance, no modification for stock acceptance, well known AK gunsmiths building them (especially the Gordon Technologies firm). The cons are (IMO): unproven american parts, used Hungarian surplus parts (which some may look at as real & proven AK parts). If both were being offered to me as a free door prize, I'd probably take the SLR100H. P.S. I did own a Saiga (in the form of the Saiga 12 gauge shotgun), and I did sell it (not too long ago). The reason for selling it was not because of function, but rather because of overall length, overall styling, and overall quality. Even though she worked flawless for me right out of the box, it did not have the right styling (should really be pistol gripped like the one they sell to the law enforcement departments http://www.ak-47.net/akcgi/smile.gif) The other thing, damn they are long! The other is the overall quality look and feel, just does not have it (at least not for my taste buds). Take that same basic gun in the Saiga 7.62x39, and start jimmy rigging this and that, and it just ain't gonna be my cup of tea. The Russians (Mr. Kalashnikov), gave us a great design, but in todays AK market, I feel they are no longer the best. Kinda like Colt/1911-A1 pistols, they no longer offer the best. It really is true that sometimes the student will exel over the teacher.

[This message has been edited by S-S-R-9-9 (edited 09-04-2000).]

[Cannon Cocker]

Thanks for the info and opinions guys. Looks like I'll be getting the 100H, as it has received some rave reviews here (Gordon Tech and Blue Ridge). Looks like the current ban wont effect the 103's for a while, so I can pick one of those up after they work out the bugs.

[backblast]

I am not impressed with these 103's. These are parts guns, using whatever is available and being slapped together without any real care. Money is the object here. My opinion.

cya

[S-S-R-9-9]

Well the Saigas are not parts guns. They are complete Russian made guns, that once in this country, get the modifications needed for the look we all like. The thing about the saigas is that they are AK's that received design changes needed for sporting rifle appearance, then now they are being messed with for the Assault Rifle appearance. Too much messing around for me! The SLR100H is really the parts gun. It takes a new receiver (and some american parts), and then it's joined together with used military AK parts off real full auto AK's. The ArsenalUSA SSR99 (not the P version) was not a parts gun, nor was it a modified import (as are the romaks, maadis, and Saiga 2's), because they were built here from scratch using all new parts. Not unlike many automobiles that are built here in the USA (and abroad) using many domestic and foreign made parts. In my opinion there are three types of modern post ban Ak's, they are: the modified import (EXAMPLEs/ SAR1, Saiga 2), there is the parts gun (EXAMPLEs/ SSR99-P, SLR100-H), and the American production/custom guns (EXAMPLEs/ SSR99, K101) This last one I mentioned, are U.S. produced in one of two ways, the first is when a company (like ArsenalUSA) goes and orders all the necessary new parts (Domestic, Foreign, or both), and has them built here in the U.S., using these parts. They are built from the ground up using the contracted parts. The other way is to have a gunsmith build you an AK using all new parts, still a new gun, but not a standard production model off of a companies production line. This is in my mind a new gun, but I consider the second method a custom build. Of course this is only the way I look at these new weapons, your thoughts may differ http://www.ak-47.net/akcgi/smile.gif

[This message has been edited by S-S-R-9-9 (edited 09-04-2000).]

[This message has been edited by S-S-R-9-9 (edited 09-04-2000).]

[Ruan]

backblast, i take it that you are not happy with your AK103? Please tell me why, because i was considering buying one this next week...

[backblast]

Hi Ruan. I do not have one of the 103's. I have one of Kreb's 104's and think the world of it. My opinion of the 103 comes from some of the folks in the know and they are not impressed with them either.

SSR99, yes, you are right about the parts gun thing. It was the way I felt about what they are doing to these fine rifles. They are just slapping them together with no TLC in them or anything. Just put 'em together, paint 'em and ship 'em. I would rather spend a few more bucks and get a good rifle than save a few and get a second rate rifle.

Know what I mean?

The 103's I am sure can be tweeked to become fine rifles. But what you are getting is not what it should be. That's all.

cya

[Ruan]

backblast, what price range are the Kreb's 104s going for and where can i get one? Thanks for all the info, Ruan...

[S-S-R-9-9]

Yeah Backblast, we are on the same wave-link http://www.ak-47.net/akcgi/smile.gif

[lone wolf]

Well guys, I posted a couple of days ago on my ak-103 having problems, going full auto with three rd bursts and five rd bursts, I cleaned it up and lubed it real well and went back to the range, first mag third shot three rd burst, did it about nine times with three 30 rd mags. Then it did something different while slow firing it would eject spent cart. chamber new one but the hammer would not cock I would pull trigger and nothing look inside and hammer was resting on bolt not cocked, manually rack slide and round would fire, did this about 10 or 11 times in about 100 rds. Went home and called Brad Williams he is the one i bought the gun from, he gave me the number of Don Kuinnel he is the one that made the gun into the ak-103. I called Don and he told me the send the gun to him so he could check it out, I sent it out on thursday I will let you know how I made out. I almost forget the gas tube was so tight that you could not get it off unless you used a screw driver to pry it off. My slr-95 is looking better and better to me everyday.

[backblast]

Ruan, the 104 that I purchased here in Alaska from the store I frequent came to a total of $900. It sounds high, but until you know who Mark Kreb is, it is worth it. If you like contact KUSA and see what they have to say about him.

Have talked to some who have worked for him and have incredible things to say about this man. He is famous for his .45 race pistols and his true love is belt feeds and HK's.

As a matter of fact, he produced the only HK chambered in 7.62x39 outside of Germany. Full chamber fluting and everything. Works flawlessly. Info obtained from Germany. Amazing.

He has the base rifle offered for $755. I do not mind paying extra for quality work. It is worth it.

He takes every rifle personally, and my 104 is no exception. Haven't sat down and checked accuracy, but can hit a 12" square off hand at 325m. Not bad for a 14" bbl(muzzle comp makes up the 2.25".)

I have pictures posted here of my Kreb's 104. For example, the gas block he produces himself. Yes, he makes those for these rifles!

Kreb's Custom Guns
940 Forest Edge Dr.
Vernon Hills IL 60061
847-821-7763
847-821-7765 fax


cya



[This message has been edited by backblast (edited 09-05-2000).]