CQB Pistol AR 15! What you think?

[Gator Batexx]

http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b7ce23b3127ccebd40193d5a6c00000026108AYuXLFyzcNd
http://im1.shutterfly.com/procserv/47b7ce23b3127ccebd403954db2500000026108AYuXLFyzcNd

I picked this up just for in the house. It's the K23P by Oly arms.
Took it out as soon as I got it and it never missed a beat.
Do you think this would make a good entry gun?
It's short enough and you can still get a cheak weld with it.
Lots of fun.

[Buster Charlie]

It's a neat gun, but honestly I think kel-tec has that market covered with their PLR-16

http://www.4rs.net/stuff/plr3.jpg

Lighter, no buffer tube, and I imagine cheaper :)


But that's just my preference.

However in all fairness i'm sure we're gonna get some folks telling us we're both wrong and .45 ACP is more powerful than .223.

PS... That is not my gun.

[Gator Batexx]

I just think the pistol its self would be better than the carbine, M-4 ect ect.

[RJ Shooter]

Wassup Cape Coral - Englewood here... ;)

[Gator Batexx]

Wassup Cape Coral - Englewood here... ;)

Hi Naber !! Get any snow this year yet!! :hohyeah:

[Blubaru]

cool guns. I have never seen the one on the top before.

[Glock and Dagger]

AR's must have stocks on them to be useful. I know that would turn it into an SBR, and no one should have to bribe the gov't for permission to exercise a God given right, or beg anyone for permission, either.

[Buster Charlie]

AR's must have stocks on them to be useful.

Good thing the PLR-16 is not a pistol.

http://www.gunblast.com/Kel-Tec_PLR-16.htm

At first, I thought of the PLR-16 as a really fun plinker; something that could be taken out for blasting away some cheap surplus ammo. The weapon fills this role very well, and I almost did not even attempt to test the gun for accuracy. However, I did attach a Trijicon Reflex dot sight atop the Kel-Tec. I prefer the Trijicon above all other dot sights, as it never needs batteries, and is always "on", being powered by tritium. After seeing how accurate the PLR-16 appeared to be, I sat down at the bench and fired a few groups with the Trijicon attached. I was impressed, so I then mounted a scope and tested the weapon for accuracy at one hundred yards, with very pleasing results. This gun is much more than just a fun plinker. It has the accuracy potential for long range hunting, much like a semi-auto Thompson Contender. It should prove a lot of fun on vermin, and would do very well for turkey hunting, where legal to use a pistol. Groups hovered around one inch with good ammo at one hundred yards, with some surplus stuff grouping about twice that big.

Read this, police magazine, this guy is praising the PLR-16 as duty worthy.

http://www.policemag.com/Articles/2006/09/Arsenal.aspx

For tactical use, the optional sling system is also a must. Kel-Tec’s kit includes a steel sling loop, mounting screws, and the sling itself. Once properly adjusted, the sling makes the pistol almost as stable as a stocked weapon. When not being used, the weapon hangs conveniently at the ready. Because of the gun’s light weight, about three pounds without a magazine, it is not a chore to carry the PLR-16 around the neck and shoulder.

I set up my targets at 25 yards to do my initial sight in with the EOTech and I was impressed with the tiny groups that the PLR-16 produced. Once I had the sights regulated, I moved the targets back to 50 yards and concentrated on adding pressure to the trigger until the shot broke.

My Kel-Tec pistol has a long and heavy seven-pound pull, and I did my best to keep the inner dot of the larger circle of the EOTech on the one-inch pasters that I used for targets. I was amazed that all of my groups measured under 1.5 inches for a five-shot group with the best group clustering under an inch. Over the years I have tested many AR-15 carbines that couldn’t match that level of accuracy, and it is important to remember that this is a pistol, weighing less than half of what the carbines weigh and it only has a nine-inch barrel.

After adjusting the sling, I fired the PLR-16 in some rapid-fire exercises. Muzzle climb is noticeably more than that of a .223 carbine, and it did make me wish that I could install the verboten vertical foregrip. With some practice I was able to get the time between shots down without sacrificing hits. Compared to other AR-style pistols that I have fired this particular gun has much better handling characteristics thanks to its lack of protruding buffer tube. The pistol is only 18.5 inches long and well balanced.

I took the PLR-16 out for a session of night shooting to see just how effective the Insight M6X laser/light is. I had a shooting dummy set up at about 30 yards and fired about 10 shots, all from the hip, using only the laser dot as an aiming point. I fired as fast as I could center the dot on the chest and press the trigger. All 10 shots landed in a cluster about the size of my fist. I could clearly see the laser out to 100 yards, even when it was used in conjunction with the light. I think the combination of the EOTech and Insight M6X light/laser combination will effectively handle just about any tactical scenario.

I finished my evaluation before ever cleaning the PLR-16, and I fired close to 1,000 rounds. I even fired some of the new Wolf 62-grain ammo and had no extraction problems with the steel-cased ammunition. In fact, I didn’t have any stoppages or malfunctions during the course of my testing. Disassembly of the pistol is easy and requires no special tools. One thing that I did notice was that, even after all of those rounds, the inside of the receiver was far from being dirty enough to induce a malfunction.

a bit about the author of that 2nd article.

Mike Detty is an NRA-certified rifle, pistol, and shotgun instructor. A certified rangemaster and competition shooter, Detty served as an officer in the U.S. Marine Corps and holds a degree in criminal justice from the University of Arizona.

[saleen]

Thread resurrection alert! :D

Despite what the Kel-Tec reviewer stated, I disagree as to the pistol being duty ready. I don't discount that he was able to get acceptable accuracy from the platform, but that required carfully tensioning a sling system and concentrating on every trigger pull. For CQB or a home defense scenario, that isn't the best choice IMHO. If you must have a short barrel, then make it an SBR. If not, then stay with a carbine length barrel and make your shots count. Under stress, a suspended/tension system like he is advocating is far inferior to a stocked weapon, and should you have to keep a downed suspect covered for any length of time, you'll find that the suspended system on a pistol will smoke your arms long before help arrives.

Just my .02 on the issue, but the trade-offs for a shorter platform just aren't worth it if the SBR isn't an option.


Saleen