Why bother with USA Parts Kits?

[Butt Plate]

I would like to modify my SLR-95 to get rid of the butthole stock. I've read here that I can add a USA parts kit to make this a "California Legal" modification. My question is simply, why bother? A little history... In 1989, Patrick Purdy murdered several children at the Cleveland Elementary School in Stockton, California, causing President Bush to ban over 40 makes of semi-automatic rifles later that year. Not satisfied with that ban, Clinton passed one of his own called the "Violent Crime Control and Law Enforcement Act of 1994." (Shouldn't it be called the Gun Control Act of 1994?) This bill, known lovingly as "the 1994 Crime Bill" specified a long list of makes and models that were banned from production and importation, especially because they contained evil and deadly features such as "flash suppressors", "pistol grips" and "bayonet lugs." (When was the last time a disgruntled postal-worker went on a rampage and bayonetted his co-workers? Has anyone ever been muzzle-flashed to death?) (Note that the reason for banning these weapons is because they weren't suitable for "sporting " purposes." Unbelievably, the BATF asked gun-clubs nation-wide if AKMs were suitable for skeet-shooting and for National Match competition. The answer being "no", they then sought out scores of hunters and asked how many of them used the 7.62x39 for hunting elk and bear and such. Not surprisingly, none were found. Apparently, this is how the BATF determined that AKs were not suitable for "sporting purposes." I'm dead serious.) Returning to the question of legality, frankly, I'm confused when our beloved AK's were banned, in 1989 or in 1994? Does "pre-ban" refer to pre-'89 or pre-'94? Anyway, since only 5% of the owners of these weapons chose to either surrender them or register them, aren't all pre-ban AK's technically illegal weapons? And if so, how can they legally be bought, sold or transferred? Well, after the ban, the market responded by omitting the offending features, which left us with our un-lugged, un-unsupressed, butthole-stocked variants. Unamused by the market's creative adaptation, our Fearless Leader counter-attacked again with a renewed ban in 1998, and I suppose this is why my local gunshop owners are telling me that SLR-95's and SA-85's are no longer being imported, (get them while you can!) I've been long-winded, but here is the source of my dilemma. Since "Pistol Packing" Don Peratta (he and Dianne Feinstein want to ban all OUR guns. So, remind me again why THEY get to have concealed carry permits??? Dianne, can you say H-I-P-O-C-R-A-C-Y?) has all but guaranteed that SB-23 is going to become California law, my sources are warning that all semi-automatic rifles CAPABLE OF ACCEPTING MAGAZINES WITH CAPACITY OVER 10 ROUNDS WILL BE BANNED. ALL AKs! ALL ARs! Even M1As! No more 20 round mags. (Stock up on bolt-action rifles now!) If true, then I can see no point in buying a "USA Legal Parts Kit," since all of the guns we Californian's own will be instantly be illegal, and the only legal guns will be those like the VEPR and the SA2000, for which no magazines exist or will exist that hold more than 10 rounds. Since I will neither surrender nor register the guns in my collection, they will become illegal guns, USA parts kit or no USA parts kit. Can anyone confirm the impacts of Peratta's SB-23? Can anyone make a compelling case why I shouldn't just modify my Maadi with pre-ban furniture? I hope I'm wrong about SB-23. PS -- my understanding of the history of the gun bans is incomplete, so corrections are encouraged!

[Destroyer]

Not to be cynical, BUT most police officers don't even know what pre and post means so I don't know who's arresting these "ordinary" folk. Of course I would not suggest making any weapon illegal (whatever that might mean) and I certainly don't plan on doing it any time soon.... I just wonder how the ATF found those "terrible criminals".... Maybe by scanning discussion forums for people who say "why should I...". ;^)

[This message has been edited by Destroyer (edited April 08, 1999).]

[zero]

Destroyer is right about one thing, cop's don't know any thing about these law's, if you ask ten cop's the same question you'll get ten different answer's. Think of this one thing, what the hell is the difference in stock's, i guess when shot with a weapon that has a thumb hole stock it don't hurt is bad, and they can ban whatever but it isn't going to solve a dam thing and we all know it, all it's going to do is make criminal's out of law abiding citizen's and the funny thing is is they can't even keep up with the criminal's on the street but it don't take alot to catch honest people who don't bother anyone. I could go on and on but it makes me mad so i won't.

[Butt Plate]

Long Duck, you've convinced me. I might as well buy the USA kit and save myself the potential grief. I don't own a pre-ban and haven't yet modified my post-ban guns. It's just that here in the People's Democratic Republic of California, Senate Bill SB-23 seems to make all rifles with detachable mags illegal, and I though I could save $100, the reasoning being that my guns will then be illegal, and illegal is illegal, right? Apparently not. Hello, USA Legal Parts Kit. Good-bye California. Time to find a new State.

[LongDuck]

Well, not living in CA, I can only answer your last question about a compelling reason *not* to install pre-ban configuration stocks on your post-ban rifle - and it is pretty compelling:

The BATF takes weapons violations very seriously, and I have heard and read horror stories of them prosecuting individuals (yes, normal, every-day kinds of people) for automatic weapons when they had a faulty sear, or for other violations based on the appearance or pre/post configuration based on the 1994 Crime Bill. The penalties they impose are very harsh, and once they have sunk their teeth, it's up to you and the best attorney you can afford to prove them wrong - until then, your gun is confiscated contraband, and your butt is likely in jail until hearing.

Best advice is to leave it post-ban or invest in the US Parts Kit - at least that keeps it legal until something worse happens and AK's are banned in your home state. Good luck, shoot straight.

[Destroyer]

LongDuck,
That's COOL. Now if only it wasn't so dry out there...

[This message has been edited by Destroyer (edited April 09, 1999).]

[LongDuck]

I was once pulled over for a traffic violation here in Arizona, and as is parlance for our CCW state, the first thing that I mentioned to the officer when he reached my door was that I had a weapon in the car. Not knowing what to expect from an officer when you tell them this, I was amused that he replied with;

"Hell, son, this is Arizona - everybody has a loaded gun in their car!"

Got off with a warning, too! - true story.

[TinMan99]

Yeah! Why not just leave the freak-show in California for a more gun-friendly state, like Georgia or Arizona. http://www.ak-47.net/akcgi/smile.gif Lots of jobs here. Lots of public ranges. The earth don't move out here and screw up your aim. http://www.ak-47.net/akcgi/wink.gif The air here is breathable, the water falls from the sky, we call it rain. http://www.ak-47.net/akcgi/wink.gif Unless youre in Northern California, at which point, we do have sunny weather. http://www.ak-47.net/akcgi/wink.gif You don't get nickle-and-dimed to death with taxes and fees. Gas costs under a buck, and it's considered normal to own guns, go to gunshows, go hunting, collect firearms, and lawfully enjoy your firearms in responsible fashion. You couldn't pay me enough to live out there. I'm waiting for the big one to hit and have California slide off into the Pacific. Get out while you can, man! Heh...
Seriously, have you considered perhaps relocating to a more friendly state?

TinMan 99

[Butt Plate]

Hey Tinman99. Thanks for cheering me up, man. Weee... If I'm ever in a REALLY good mood and I feel an irrepressible urge to go into a .50 cal. depression, I'll just save your post and read it over and over and over...

Frankly, I'm thinking about moving more and more. I have reasons for wanting to stay, but the reasons to leave just keep stacking up deeper and deeper on the other side of the scale.

The noble thing is to stay and fight and not let them take this state from us. But I really think its just a matter of time before I move.

[TinMan99]

I hope I did honestly cheer you a little. The only way you can fight is by some miracle that a conservative Govenor and legislature is elected that a) bans municipalities from passing laws that limit your rights under the Second Amendment. b) repeal all excessive laws banning the lawful ownership and responsible use of firearms. In California, you're more likely to be hit by an asteroid than have this happen in your lifetime. I live in Georgia, there are no bans on honest, law-abiding citizens from owning as many legal guns as they want. Legal here includes AK's, AR's, FN/FAL's, you name it. Class 3's are legal. There's a store outside of Atlanta that has a Finnish 20mm anti-tank rifle for sale as well as belt-feed machine guns and full auto's, but you gotta get a Class 3 permit. The vintage and antique collectables market is pretty abundant down here, weather's not too bad. You trade earthquakes for the ocassional tornado but we're not talking the kind that hosed Oklahoma the other day. We have nice beaches, mountains, and a lot of unspoiled wilderness areas. Hunting here is something that is encouraged while we have a wildlife management and wilderness protection program that makes certain we don't get paved over. Jobs are fairly abundant across all lines of business. We're gun friendly here without being irresponsible. Gun shows require background checks on weapons purchases and you have to be 21 to lawfully purchase a firearm of any sort. We have a must-issue CCW permit law but you have to wait two to three months while an exhaustive background check is done on you by the GBI. Permits are good for five years and can be same-day renewed when it gets close to expiring. For purposes of legality, you can carry a gun in your car in GA without a CCW because the GA legislature made your car part of your home in response to a wave of carjackings. Guess what happened. A LOT fewer carjackings after the first few found themselves staring down the barrel of a motorists gun. Life clicks along here at a slower pace, our legislators aren't a pack of whiney bleeding heart liberals, our gun interests and lobby are strong, hunting and firearm ownership are institutions. Penalties for law-breakers with guns are harsh and enforced vigorously. We aren't perfect but we don't penalize our vast majority of law-abiding citizens for the wanton acts of a tiny handful of those that abuse firearms. Oh, and Georgia has a ban on municipalities passing laws restricting your gun rights and from citizens and local governments from suing gun and ammo manufacturers. There are still places where common sense rules, so just keep us in mind if it gets too thick for you out there.

Tin Man 99

Buttplate,
I lived out your way for several years, and I'll agree Cali has some nice things about it. That said, one of the happest days of my life was the day I moved back where I don't have to be a criminal to excersize my constitutional rights. Short of NY or NJ, you couldn't possibly live in a worse place for someone who is pro-gun. I'd suggest leaving before Arizona closes it's border and you're stuck out there.
Butch...

I heard the Dodgers were one of the teams who wanted to play next year in Cuba. They were turned down, as the commisioner of baseball feared the players would defect. http://www.ak-47.net/akcgi/wink.gif