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Twisted Cross
05-15-2002, 03:32 PM
http://reason.com/hod/sm112101.shtml



Shooting Match

Does the anti-gun crowd think you're stupid?

By Sam MacDonald



How bad has the post-September 11 era been for the anti-gun lobby? To understand fully, consider a simple thought experiment:

You are dreaming cozily in your bed when you hear your front door give way with a crash. Moments later, you hear two sets of footsteps thudding up the stairs toward your bedroom. Your first thought is to pick up the phone and dial 911, but you know the intruders will be upon you long before the police arrive. As a last resort, you reach into the nightstand and pull out your .44 Magnum. You thank god that you reached it in time, open the window, toss the gun into the bushes below, and turn to face your assailants unarmed.

Welcome to Self Defense 101, according to the Violence Policy Center. In a study the anti-gun group published this Monday, VPC argues that handguns should be outlawed because they don't work. Or more specifically, they do work: You're just too stupid to figure out how to use one. Seriously.

The 90-page document is titled "Unintended Consequences: Pro-Handgun Experts Prove that Handguns Are a Dangerous Choice for Self-Defense." The report cites all the usual suspects, including numbers that show more people die from gun-related suicides than gun-related homicides. (Message: If you are dumb enough to buy a gun, you're probably dumb enough to kill yourself with it. On purpose.)

In a press release accompanying the report, its author, VPC senior policy analyst Tom Diaz, says, "This study is comprised substantially of writings from pro-gun experts who readily admit handguns are basically impossible to use effectively in self-defense."

The supposed innovation is the report's reliance on usually trigger-happy analysts who at some point during their careers mentioned that if you do buy a gun, you should probably figure out which end the bullets come out before you try to blast a burglar. There is even an appendix that serves as a preemptive strike against anyone informed enough to mention Prof. John Lott's substantial body of work as a counter-argument.

It's not exactly news that some people think that it's "basically impossible" to use a gun to defend yourself. What's more instructive here is to note just how far the anti-gun lobby has fallen, and what a recent spate of setbacks has done to the once-powerful movement. They are no longer simply wrong. They are becoming desperate.

The litany is quite gruesome, really. The disarmament coalition lost its champion when President Bill Clinton squirmed out of office. Al Gore lost the election to a Republican from gun-happy Texas, who promptly appointed John Ashcroft attorney general. Ashcroft soon added injury to insult when he wrote a letter to the National Rifle Association promising to uphold the Second Amendment as an individual right. The thrashing continued in October when the U.S. Court of Appeals for the 5th Circuit threw its judicial weight behind Ashcroft's interpretation. Court decisions last fall and this spring that dismissed huge city lawsuits against gun manufacturers certainly didn't help.

These official setbacks pale in comparison to a far more pervasive threat, however: People just aren't so keen on gun-control stories anymore. A National Academies of Science study that could eventually provide a sea change in gun-control laws kicked off in August. Except for a cable news representative who showed up three hours late, Reason was the only media outlet that covered it. Nobody is complaining about a provision in the aviation security bill that allows airlines to arm pilots. There is no talk of gun control in other anti-terror legislation. On October 9, a Washington Post story reported that the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence (formerly Handgun, Inc.) was hit so hard by the slowing economy and funds diverted to terror victims that the vocal organization has laid off 14 staffers, a full 20 percent of its workforce. The National Association of Chiefs of Police issued their 14th annual survey on Monday. Over 93 percent said yes to "Should any law abiding citizen be able to purchase a firearm for sport or self-defense?" Over 62 percent said concealed handgun permits would help reduce crime. This caused exactly zero waves on the political or media landscape.

John Q. Public doesn't seem so sure that it's "basically impossible" to use a gun in self defense, either. The October 22 Washington Post reported that in the month following the attacks, traffic at the FBI's National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) was up 20 percent over last year. On October 15, the Los Angeles Times reported that in California, "the number of people buying guns jumped by more than 50% the week of the attacks… and has remained about 32% above the previous year." On November 8, The Dallas Morning News reported that applications for concealed-carry permits in Texas nearly tripled in the two months following September 11.

This explosion in demand is not lost on the fine folks at the Violence Prevention Center. In the aforementioned press release, officials claim that they issued the new report "in response to the reported spike in handgun sales since the September 11th attacks." They accuse the gun industry of using the terror attacks to forward its agenda. If sales are any indication—and if the best argument against guns is that people are too dumb to use them—that effort might be easier than anyone ever imagined.



Sam MacDonald is Reason's Washington editor.

survivor99
05-22-2002, 06:52 AM
Well, in the scenario of running footsteps coming into my place, unwelcomed....... All I can say is that they'd better be prepared to meet their creator because that's exactly where their asses are headed!!! Many of us gun owners have handled guns safely all our lives. We've never committed a crime with them, nor have we committed suicide. These lame-minded fools can say what they like and even believe their own lies.... but given the same situation, they'd be crying for a weapon to defend themselves with. I can see Sarah Brady pleading with criminals in her home not to hurt her.......

I guess what really pisses me off is the wave of anti-gun sentiment of this country. When I was a boy, all families where I grew up shot and hunted. We all owned guns. The highschool I graduated from was large. We had 1300 seniors who graduated in my class. Every pickup truck in those vast parking lots had gunracks in the cab, filled with shotguns and hunting rifles. No one ever took one out and killed anyone with it. No one even locked their vehicles!!!

Today, the sheeple public looks at our children as if all they exist for is to kill other kids with guns. It has happened a few times but it's not the gun's fault. Look at the weapons used of late.... plastic explosives, pipe bombs, vehicle bombs, box cutters.....

IGNORANCE of the facts is our biggest enemy. If sheeple would take the TIME to really LEARN what guns are all about, things would be different.

survivor99

NOTPARS
05-22-2002, 08:06 AM
For Survivor99:

I say amen to what you posted. I am one of a few pro-gun teachers at my high school of around 2400 students. I am the only NRA life member, and in my department, Social(ist) Studies, the only one of 17 teachers who is pro-Second Amendment. The others range from disinterested to severely and hysterically anti-gun.
Last semester, some students came into my class and said, Mrs. so and so said we need to work harder to keep guns out of the hands of kids. What do you have to say about it. I told them I was saving up money so I could get more guns into the hands of kids...my two older daughters (ages 9 and 11). I have a Marlin 60 in stainless and I am buying a Ruger Mark II .22 in stainless. We are going to shoot together. They looked at me like I had just slapped their face. Since then, with my encouragement, several girls have been talked into joining the high school trap team. Now that they have been competitors, they love it!
In my government classes, I do an entire unit on the Second Amendment. I use a lot of material from John Lott, Jews For the Preservation of the Second Amendment, the Second Amendment Sisters, and stealth stuff from the NRA.
People who are trained, familiar with, and comfortable with firearms are much much much less likely to be victims. Those who say:

"Oh, I don't like guns, they scare me." Should trade in their drivers licenses for identification and replace it with bells to put around their necks.

survivor99
05-22-2002, 08:36 AM
NOTPARS,

I applaud you!

One of my highschool coaches used to come out to the "sticks" to quail hunt on my family's property. There have been many debates over deer hunting vs. duck hunting, too, and most of our teachers always joined into these discussions. It was wonderful in those days, before us sportsmen became hated criminals in the eyes of the public.

When I was ten I owned a single-shot .410 with a breakopen action and a hammer. My uncle found it many years before in a trash can with a broken firing pin. It was made in 1929. Well, my father hand-filed a new one from a nail and it worked until their house was robbed in the early 70's. I was taught gun safety and respect for the PRIVILEGE to own and shoot a gun, not to mention the thrill of hunting with it. In those days, marksmanship was number one, too.... probably why I am still reluctant to shoot lots of ammo up at any given trip to the range.

Everything is aimed at gun confiscation these days. Oh, they may blunt the impact by saying they're only trying to limit certain groups of people from access to guns.... but it's ALWAYS aimed at us private, law-abiding citizens who love the gun sports and competition. I think we've all suffered way too much. I say, let's take back our God-given rights to what is guaranteed to us by the Second amendment!!!

survivor99

Twisted Cross
05-22-2002, 09:48 AM
NOTPARS,

I was thinking of getting my wife aMarlin 60 SS, there real pretty looking guns that a women who doesn't shoot too much can admire. I bought one for my ex-girlfriend a long time ago, but I sold it after we broke up.

I like this site and the hats and T-shirts he has. They say I am not armed, please don't hurt me. LOL

http://flashbunny.freewebspace.com/

It's really is sad the anti-gun B.S. about how you are 43 times more likely to get killed just for owning a gun. Man! I don't know how I have stayed alive all these years under that kind of pressure! I should have had a nervous breakdown by now for sure.

Let's see, 33 years with guns around and I wonder if it rise expotentially for every gun you own. So, if your a collector with 300 guns then you would be 12,900 time more likely to die:( I wonder if they figure that per minute or per second:confused: If that was per second you would be 111456000 more likely to die everyday! Good lord! You would need to be institutionalized for that kind of pressure.:rolleyes:

I guess I'm better off because I only own 6 weapons at the moment and that only makes me 22291200 times more likely to die.

survivor99
05-22-2002, 10:44 AM
The way I see it, six guns equals 600% certain that an intruding criminal in your house will die.......

survivor99

NOTPARS
05-22-2002, 12:12 PM
For Survivor99:

When I was new at this high school in Missouri, about 10 years ago, I was congratulating myself for moving from the Bay area of California where I had worked for the People's Republic of Palo Alto. Those people make liberals look like conservatives. And talk about anti-gun, even our chief of police was anti-gun and didn't carry one to boot! Anyway, I was patting myself on the back for moving far away from the lunacy out there...that is, until I attended my first Social(ist) Studies Department meeting. One of our teachers, an NRA member, was retiring. So he said, after 33 years, the heck with meetings, and he did not attend one department meeting. Being brand new, I had no choice. They blasted him from day one. But not for failing to show up. They blasted him for being an NRA member and gun nut. It was relentless. I thought, hey wait a minute, I thought I left all those leftwing anti-gun crazies behind when I crossed the State line on Highway 80 coming out of South Lake Tahoe!!! I discovered, before too long, that my department was very liberal...very.
By the way, I never spoke at a meeting. In many meetings they bashed the NRA, Christians, conservatives, Republicans, and so forth. In their mind, their is an especially hot placed reserved in liberal hell for Ronald Reagan. Their hatred of him is almost pathological. Sooooooooooooo, after being just about the only man in the Bay area who still ate red meat and belonged to the NRA, after fighting with the city I worked for because I was not a radical environmentalist and anti-gunner, I decided to keep my mouth shut.
But little by little I began to speak up. I still don't speak at meetings. 16 against 1 is no fun. But I do speak in class...and the students repeat it...
Some of the other social(ist) studies used to spy and listen outside my classroom. I caught them many times. We have a copy clerk who does all of our copying (bless her heart) and she stacks our articles and assignments on a table for us to come in and get. She warned me they were always going through my stuff. I had articles attacking gun control from Guns And Ammo, Soldier of Fortune, you name it (still do). They came in my room and checked all my pictures and posters. They were really upset by the poster I have of Ronald Reagan declaring that communism would be transcended by freedom. Now, I didn't use any of this stuff for about the first 5 years. But, after a while, I got tired of the constant bashing and began to assert myself if you know what I mean. Again, if they had not been spying on me, they would have no idea what I think or say.
Students began coming to me and telling me how these other social(ist) studies teachers were trashing me out behind my back. At the five to six year mark, they began to shun me. Most of them, including our Marxist teacher who thinks Ho Chi Minh was a great leader, won't even speak to me. And then they took my room away from me and moved me up into half a trailer I share with Jr. Rotc by the tennis courts. There is more but it is along the same lines. Now I am vocal. I still don't speak in meetings, but I do outside.
Next year I'm getting an NRA windbreaker to wear to school. Stay tuned as this may turn into a First Amendment issue.

NOTPARS
05-22-2002, 12:21 PM
For SangRun Hunter, you might be interested to know that I address that whole nonsense about a gun being taken away from an intended crime victim and used on them by a dirtbag.

I use an article titled: "Doctors, Lawyers, Guns, & Money" by Dr. Edgar A. Suter of Doctors for Integrity in Research and Public Policy. The article was printed in the April 1995 issue of Soldier of Fortune, page 25 (thanks SOF!)!

Anyway, in this article he compares rates of injury by victim's method of protection:

1. Physical force 51%

2. Try to get help
or frighten
attacker 49%

3. knife 40%

4. non-violent
resistance like
trying to run
away 35%

5. threaten or
reason with
attacker 31%

6. other measures
(no force or
weapon) 27%

7. No self protection
submission 25%

8. Other weapon
baseball bat,
shovel, etc... 22%

9. Gun 17%


So, if you try to use physical force (and I am sure proximity plays a part) you have a 51% chance of being hurt as compared to only a 17% chance if you use a firearm!!!

The Marlin is a nice rifle. Some don't like the tube feed. But, it doesn't jam as much as my Ruger 10/22.

I had probably better not state how many firarms I have. Let's put it this way, there are a number I have yet to even fire. Haven't gotten to them yet...

survivor99
05-22-2002, 02:55 PM
NOTPARS,

It sounds like you're in a lion's den. They are interfering with your freedom of speech and expression. It seems like the NRA should be involved on some level, in my opinion. A small victory here or there are always welcome. I know it's a very touchy situation, but we honest folks are looked down on by vast majorities of sheeple. If it were me I'd be calling NRA and explaining the situation.

survivor99

NOTPARS
05-24-2002, 11:28 AM
For Survivor99:

Thanks for the support! Yeah, I will have to play it by ear. I am not trying to pick a fight or stir things up, but then, I got to thinking, am I hiding my hoby because of political correctness? Am I not being myself because I hide my hobby? Yep.
I start my tenth year next year,sooooo, I will probably get the NRA jacket. It won't make me any friends here. Their stereotype, the liberal teachers, of the NRA and people like me borders on the hysterical. Of course, we are the ones who are "nuts" according to them.

insider
06-19-2002, 07:36 PM
It's too bad those ignorant assholes are filling childrens heads with their hate and lies, stick to your guns.