Tomac
05-27-2002, 03:32 PM
Range conditions and equipment were the same as in the last range report except that we had another shooter who brought along an Ishapore Enfield in .308, a G3/HK-91 clone (Federal Arms w/turret rear sight & aluminum receiver w/optics rail?) and a Chinese M-14 for comparison.
Surprisingly, the Isahpore was a joy to shoot for a surplus bolt gun and very accurate w/surplus ammo. Recoil wasn't anywhere near as bad as I'd anticipated. Only problem was that the mag and/or mag retention mechanism was worn causing the mag to misfeed unless you slapped the mag home before chambering each shot. I may have to pick one up sometime just for fun.
The G3 clone reminded me of why I sold my HK-91. Recoil was uncomfortably sharp and we all had trouble connecting w/the 400m target using irons (could be me, my eyes are bad and I've never cared for peep sights) and the horrendous trigger pull. We also encountered an unusual malfunction where a fresh round would successfully feed but the trigger mechanism wouldn't be cocked, requiring the action to be cycled manually to cock the trigger, also ejecting the fresh rd.
The M-14's recoil seemed sharper than I remember from my military days, but then this rifle has the fake flash supressor. Functioning was fine but when I first loaded rds into the mag via stripper clips through the top of the receiver (worked very nicely, by the way) and then tried to get the bolt to close and chamber the first rd the bolt slipped off the operating rod(?!) However, this was easily fixed and never bothered us again during the course of the shoot. Again, the peep sights & trigger pull (although not as bad for me as on the G3 clone) hindered my shooting at distant targets.
With the Saiga we found the 300m target to be easy to hit w/the iron sights (they only go to 300m on the Saiga) and the recoil was much softer (a lot of that probably has to do with the nice rubber recoil pad on the Saiga) and not as sharp or abrupt as on the G3/M-14. The Saiga's trigger, while very long, was much smoother and lighter than on the G3?m-14 making hits easier at longer ranges. With a Kobra attached hits were even easier.
Tried my Hirtenberger ammo ('64 headstamp) and really wasn't impressed with the accuracy. It shot high and left compared to the SA & Portugese ammo and didn't seem to group as tightly. When I broke out the first boxes of the '74 Portugese I just received from AIM Surplus the groups tightened back up again. I was impressed with the consistency and accuracy of this nearly-30yr-old ammo.
Using the 8x42 scope we found we could consistently hit the 500m ram (appx. 24" wide by 12" high) if we were careful and did our part. Most fliers were called. The more I fired the more I became used to the long trigger pull on the Saiga. I believe with enough practice one can overcome the handicap caused by it so even if Red Star Arms or my 'smith can't do anything to improve the trigger it's not a fatal flaw.
The rangefinding features of the PSO 8x42 worked as advertised, the 18" gong at 500m measuring accurately on both the height-based rangefinder and the horiontal windage marks (which can also be used as a rangefinder). While not as precise as mildots or a laser rangefinder it's quick and easy to use, more than accurate enough for "minute of torso" shots.
The PSO 8x42 has 5 inverted chevrons total in the reticle. These are supposed to be used with the 7.62x54 when shooting past 1,000m. Just out of curiosity I set the elevation turret back to '0' and started shooting from close-in to further out to see what ranges (if any) corresponded to the other chevrons. I found I could use the first chevron easily to 300m. At 400m I needed to aim halfway between the first and second chevrons. The third chevron was dead-on at 500m and the fifth chevron was dead-on for hitting that little green bush way out there (800m+? I really need a laser rangefinder to find out for certain just how far out that is) from the first range report. This means that if you learn where your particular rifle/load shoots at different ranges then you can use the additional chevrons as automatic bullet drop marks for different ranges w/o having to manually adjust the elevation turret for those ranges.
The Saiga had 2 FTEs during the 260rds fired today, this I attribute to the first use of mags I'd modified from 8rds to 10rds by shortening the floorplate columns and the follower (need to do a little more smoothing & work to make them fully reliable). Aside from that the Saiga experienced no malfunctions of any kind (note: the gas piston is properly pinned to the bolt carrier w/just a little play, not rigidly welded like on the SARs).
Overall, the more I use the Saiga the more impressed I am with the quality & accuracy of this $299 .308 semi-auto. True, it doesn't take hicap mags, but it can be modified to take M-14 mags and I know of someone who's checking into the feasibility of modifying the Saiga to take FAL mags (wouldn't that be nice!) It also takes a variety of rugged yet inexpensive QD optics (something lacking in most MBRs).
My next steps are to improve the Saiga's trigger (if possible), add a muzzle brake and try the Saiga w/match ammo just to see what it's really capable of. This one's a keeper!...
Tomac
Surprisingly, the Isahpore was a joy to shoot for a surplus bolt gun and very accurate w/surplus ammo. Recoil wasn't anywhere near as bad as I'd anticipated. Only problem was that the mag and/or mag retention mechanism was worn causing the mag to misfeed unless you slapped the mag home before chambering each shot. I may have to pick one up sometime just for fun.
The G3 clone reminded me of why I sold my HK-91. Recoil was uncomfortably sharp and we all had trouble connecting w/the 400m target using irons (could be me, my eyes are bad and I've never cared for peep sights) and the horrendous trigger pull. We also encountered an unusual malfunction where a fresh round would successfully feed but the trigger mechanism wouldn't be cocked, requiring the action to be cycled manually to cock the trigger, also ejecting the fresh rd.
The M-14's recoil seemed sharper than I remember from my military days, but then this rifle has the fake flash supressor. Functioning was fine but when I first loaded rds into the mag via stripper clips through the top of the receiver (worked very nicely, by the way) and then tried to get the bolt to close and chamber the first rd the bolt slipped off the operating rod(?!) However, this was easily fixed and never bothered us again during the course of the shoot. Again, the peep sights & trigger pull (although not as bad for me as on the G3 clone) hindered my shooting at distant targets.
With the Saiga we found the 300m target to be easy to hit w/the iron sights (they only go to 300m on the Saiga) and the recoil was much softer (a lot of that probably has to do with the nice rubber recoil pad on the Saiga) and not as sharp or abrupt as on the G3/M-14. The Saiga's trigger, while very long, was much smoother and lighter than on the G3?m-14 making hits easier at longer ranges. With a Kobra attached hits were even easier.
Tried my Hirtenberger ammo ('64 headstamp) and really wasn't impressed with the accuracy. It shot high and left compared to the SA & Portugese ammo and didn't seem to group as tightly. When I broke out the first boxes of the '74 Portugese I just received from AIM Surplus the groups tightened back up again. I was impressed with the consistency and accuracy of this nearly-30yr-old ammo.
Using the 8x42 scope we found we could consistently hit the 500m ram (appx. 24" wide by 12" high) if we were careful and did our part. Most fliers were called. The more I fired the more I became used to the long trigger pull on the Saiga. I believe with enough practice one can overcome the handicap caused by it so even if Red Star Arms or my 'smith can't do anything to improve the trigger it's not a fatal flaw.
The rangefinding features of the PSO 8x42 worked as advertised, the 18" gong at 500m measuring accurately on both the height-based rangefinder and the horiontal windage marks (which can also be used as a rangefinder). While not as precise as mildots or a laser rangefinder it's quick and easy to use, more than accurate enough for "minute of torso" shots.
The PSO 8x42 has 5 inverted chevrons total in the reticle. These are supposed to be used with the 7.62x54 when shooting past 1,000m. Just out of curiosity I set the elevation turret back to '0' and started shooting from close-in to further out to see what ranges (if any) corresponded to the other chevrons. I found I could use the first chevron easily to 300m. At 400m I needed to aim halfway between the first and second chevrons. The third chevron was dead-on at 500m and the fifth chevron was dead-on for hitting that little green bush way out there (800m+? I really need a laser rangefinder to find out for certain just how far out that is) from the first range report. This means that if you learn where your particular rifle/load shoots at different ranges then you can use the additional chevrons as automatic bullet drop marks for different ranges w/o having to manually adjust the elevation turret for those ranges.
The Saiga had 2 FTEs during the 260rds fired today, this I attribute to the first use of mags I'd modified from 8rds to 10rds by shortening the floorplate columns and the follower (need to do a little more smoothing & work to make them fully reliable). Aside from that the Saiga experienced no malfunctions of any kind (note: the gas piston is properly pinned to the bolt carrier w/just a little play, not rigidly welded like on the SARs).
Overall, the more I use the Saiga the more impressed I am with the quality & accuracy of this $299 .308 semi-auto. True, it doesn't take hicap mags, but it can be modified to take M-14 mags and I know of someone who's checking into the feasibility of modifying the Saiga to take FAL mags (wouldn't that be nice!) It also takes a variety of rugged yet inexpensive QD optics (something lacking in most MBRs).
My next steps are to improve the Saiga's trigger (if possible), add a muzzle brake and try the Saiga w/match ammo just to see what it's really capable of. This one's a keeper!...
Tomac