Russian HP & Water Jug Tests

[Tomac]

Six 1 gal jugs in a row, taped together in pairs, cardboard between taped pairs to track fragments. Fired both the 122gr HP with the large cavity in the tip and the 124 gr with the lead further forward & a smaller cavity. First round of testing both bullets fragmented in the 3rd jug after yawing to the vertical. Fragmentation occured at the cannelure, similar to the 5.56 SS-109 round. Needless to say, the 3rd jug was shredded with only a few fragments making it to the 4th jug which slowly bled out afterwards.
Repeated the test with the 122gr HP and this time the bullet survived intact to be recovered in the 4th jug. The bullet was flattened along its length with lead being pushed up to the tip of the jacket and a few small lead fragments being deposited in the 3rd jug. The HP showed no evidence of opening, for all intents and purposes performing just like FMJ.
Results were similar with the 2nd 124gr HP except that yawing appears to have started later (probably due to the lead core being more forward in the jacket).
Repeated tests (4) resulted in no further fragmentation, just flattened bullets recovered in the 4th jug.
The majority of energy appears to have been delivered to the 2nd & 3rd jugs, these always showing the most severe damage.
I cannot explain why only the first 2 bullets fragmented. Firing distance was 12'.

[Destroyer]

Hhmmmm... So, do you think there is any difference between the hollow point and the full metal jacket? If not, do you think the soft point rounds would expand better? I hope so or I might be forced to buy some of that expensive American made hunting ammo-- ouch!

[Tomac]

There appears to be little difference between FMJ & HP in these informal tests. However, any loading with the lead core further back in the jacket will yaw faster thus giving better terminal performance (check this out: http://www.fen.baynet.de/norbert.arnoldi/army/wound.html ). Without having the chance to actually test it I would say the SP ammo should expand better (and more reliably) than the HP ammo. However, the tradeoff is possibly less penetration in tactical cover. If I get the chance to pick up some of that Romanian SP I'll run the test again and post the results. Personally I'm pretty happy with the HP (it can fragment on impact, perhaps depending upon what it hits?) as it's well sealed, accurate enough & reliable in my AKs. What we really need is a round that will penetrate like AP on tactical cover then expand like crazy in organic matter... ;-)
Tomac

[Devil Dog]

Interesting tests, but the results are what I would have expected. In my opinion, based on the examination of the construction of the Russian hollow point
7.62x39 cartridge variations that are known, these were not designed to perform as a real hollow point bullet should.
These cartridges are manufactured to satisfy the "sporting purpose" clause of the import regulations and to appeal to the general shooting population. My reasons are as follows:

1. These cartridges have a steel jacket which resists uniform expansion. "Big Game" hunting bullets are known to have steel jackets for the very reason of resisting expansion and deformity, allowing greater penetration.
2. The hollow point is very shallow, again resisting the tendencancy expand uniformly, or at all.
3. The variations having the large hollow cavity also go against the theory of a proper hollow point design.
4. Early imports of this ammunition have been reported to be steel core bullets with a hole drilled in the tip to satisfy import regulations. This reinforces the theory of
the design being one which is simply meant to satisfy import regulations.
5. Known Russian military issue hollow point cartridges (KGB issue) have a different lead tip/hollow point profile.

Soft point cartridges, even with a steel jacket, are more likely to perform as designed due to the larger surface area of lead to start initial expansion.

Not to say that this Russian ammunition is inferior, just that one should not expect performance better than regular FMJ.

If you want hollow point or soft point performance, you should get commercial manufactured ammunition with a copper jacket.

D.D.

[Destroyer]

Tomac,
Thanks for the cool site. I now know to stay well away from the Germans!

[Floyd]

Has anyone done any checks on how effective steel-core, bimetal-jacketed, and copper-jacketed are against steel plate or other armor? The Wolf ammo I have is the deep HP with the bimetal (copper plated(?) steel jacket)...

[Big Fish]

Interesting results!
About a week ago I shot a coon (weight 35lbs)at about 50 yards with a 7.62x39 Russian hollow point(head stsmp is 94 711).I don't know what weight the bullet is, but the bullet went in the size of a pencil and came out the size of a large softball.