okjoe@aol.com
01-29-2000, 04:19 AM
I have been trying to get police and others interested in
the Point & Shoot (P&S), method of shooting, and in
using what I call a P&S Index Finger Rest for some time
now.
You may be interested in the results of two recent test
shoots using a peel and stick version of the P&S Index
Finger Rest. The results are below.
First, here is some info on the P&S method of shooting and
the P&S index finger rest. You can skip this part and get to
the results below if you like, but P&S is not Point Shooting
as that term is generally understood.
THE P&S SHOOTING METHOD
The P&S method of shooting is a method of instinctive
shooting that is fast and accurate.
P&S has been tested and developed at the Vermont Police
Academy. There, the term Point Shooting was used to ID it.
That unfortunately,can result in some confusion as to just
what is being talked about, and that is why I use the term
P&S to identify it.
P&S is almost if not totally instinctive and mechanical, not
cognitive and mechanical, and it is expected to be the next
step in the evolution of survival shooting. It is taught to VSP
members.
The basics of P&S are not new, but they are not widely
known and accepted in the gun community for use with
pistols. For example, I was told by and old sergeant to
use the method away back in 1954 when shooting my
grease gun from the hip.
THE P&S INDEX FINGER REST
The P&S Index Finger Rest is a simple, cheap, reliable,
and easy to use addon that provides the means for using
the P&S shooting method. It allows one to shoot fast,
accurately, and multiple times instinctively at night or day,
and with little or no training. It can be part of the grip or
the frame, or it can be a separate attachment.
The P&S Index Finger Rest is added to the side of the gun
just above the trigger guard. It extends about 3/4 of an inch
out from the side of the gun like a small shelf. It is aligned
with the barrel and positioned so that when you grasp the
gun, your index finger will fit snugly up against it.
END VIEW
OOOO
OOOO
OOOO_____ <- Finger Rest
OOOO|
OOOO|
OOOO
OOOO
OOOO
OOOO
To use it:
1. You grasp the gun,
2. Point your index finger at the target, and
3. Shoot using your middle or left index finger.
That is all there is to it.
Additional information on P&S is available via e-mail or on
my web site: http://members.aol.com/okjoe/ps.htm
TEST RESULTS:
"Test" versions of the P&S Index Finger Rest were sent to
several people late last year. I followed up with questions
on how their test shoots went.
The questions I sent and the responses received to date are
below. They are sparse, but like other tests before them,
they prove that the P&S method of shooting and the P&S
Index Finger Rest in fact do work.
If you would like to get some "Test" versions for testing,
check out my web site for info.
********************
Questions Asked:
********************
A. Were you able to shoot fast, accurately, multiple times,
and instinctively using the "Test" P&S Index Finger Rest?
B. Would you recommend that other police agencies test
them?
C. Would you recommend that gun makers offer a frame
or grip that incorporates a P&S Index Finger Rest?
D. Any general or specific comments?
*************
Responses:
*************
I have shot using the P&S method. I have had varied results.
I shot 700 rounds using the method with my S&W 4506.
100 at 1 yard (quick draw...shoot from the hip)
100 at 3 yards double tap technique
100 at 5 yards 3 rounds in 5 seconds
100 at 7 yards 3 rounds in 5 seconds
100 at 10 yards
100 at 15 yards
100 at 25 yards
From 10 yards and under, I found that it was extremely
accurate... and to be honest... how many gun fights will you
get into at more than that?
At the 15 yard mark, I had trouble keeping the target, until I
canted the weapon to the left (I'm a righty shooter)... gangster
style... but not as much cant... maybe 45 degrees.
At the 25 yard mark, I had trouble hitting the target. I can see
the potential for this technique, but I guess I must practice it
at long range to become extremely accurate.
I think I would be a great idea to have this technique taught
at the police academies and also have the gun manufacturers
create a grip with the guide built in... but maybe not as wide
off the grip. Maybe a 1/4 inch off the gun... just using it as
support anyway.
**********
**********
I find no difference either myself or by students between this
training aid and using a frame characteristic. I tried glue-on
dots { they are used as non-abrasive feet for calculators etc.
and are 3/16" dia.} as a more acceptable, holsterable substitute.
They are just as successful in untrained hands.
2. If you made a test shoot:
A. Were you able to shoot fast, accurately, multiple times,
and instinctively using the "Test" P&S Index Finger Rest?
They [the students] could point shoot.
I cannot say I was but then I am an above average shot. I can
put 5 shots from a .357 into 3" at 7 yds in 2 seconds.
B. Would you recommend that other police agencies test
them?
As a training adjuct, why not.
C. Would you recommend that gun makers offer a frame
or grip that incorporates a P&S Index Finger Rest?
no
D. Any general or specific comments?
Point shooting is the sensible route to defensive use of pistol
at 5 yards or less. This is one way to teach point shooting.
It is not a practical carry gun alternative.
**********
**********
Here are some added comments of mine.
It is an odd quirk of the gun community, that handguns used
by the average shooter, are no different than those used by
the experts. Though the same can be said of the tools used
in other arenas, in other areans, your life most probably will
not be forfeited if you lose.
Police gunfight accuracy rates and police casualty rates cry
out for improvment in close quarters shooting methods and
means, or both. The P&S method and a P&S Index Finger
Rest provide such a response.
In a test I made with a "Test" P&S Index Finger Rest, I was
able to hit an 11 x 17 inch target at 25 feet, 6 out of 7 times
while shooting as fast as I could point my indexfinger at the
target and pull the trigger, and I hadn't shot a gun in over 40
years when I made the test.
A lot of people have said the P&S is bs, or that it just won't
work, etc.. However none of them have tried it or a P&S
Index Finger Rest. They must have crystal balls or some
other means of determining what works and what doesn't
by just thinking about it. No one who has tried either the
method or a finger rest has said they don't work.
A P&S Index Finger Rest can help to equalize the difference
between the expert and the average shooter, and increase
the shooting ability of one non expert shooter over another.
And what is true for gun professionals, is even more true for
the anxious home defender who may have bought a gun with
the thought in mind that in a high stress situation, when their
life was on the line, they would be able to use it effectively in
their self defense.
More info and rationales for using the P&S method and P&S
Index Finger Rests are available on my web site: http://members.aol.com/okjoe/ps.htm.
Will work for assault rifles too.
the Point & Shoot (P&S), method of shooting, and in
using what I call a P&S Index Finger Rest for some time
now.
You may be interested in the results of two recent test
shoots using a peel and stick version of the P&S Index
Finger Rest. The results are below.
First, here is some info on the P&S method of shooting and
the P&S index finger rest. You can skip this part and get to
the results below if you like, but P&S is not Point Shooting
as that term is generally understood.
THE P&S SHOOTING METHOD
The P&S method of shooting is a method of instinctive
shooting that is fast and accurate.
P&S has been tested and developed at the Vermont Police
Academy. There, the term Point Shooting was used to ID it.
That unfortunately,can result in some confusion as to just
what is being talked about, and that is why I use the term
P&S to identify it.
P&S is almost if not totally instinctive and mechanical, not
cognitive and mechanical, and it is expected to be the next
step in the evolution of survival shooting. It is taught to VSP
members.
The basics of P&S are not new, but they are not widely
known and accepted in the gun community for use with
pistols. For example, I was told by and old sergeant to
use the method away back in 1954 when shooting my
grease gun from the hip.
THE P&S INDEX FINGER REST
The P&S Index Finger Rest is a simple, cheap, reliable,
and easy to use addon that provides the means for using
the P&S shooting method. It allows one to shoot fast,
accurately, and multiple times instinctively at night or day,
and with little or no training. It can be part of the grip or
the frame, or it can be a separate attachment.
The P&S Index Finger Rest is added to the side of the gun
just above the trigger guard. It extends about 3/4 of an inch
out from the side of the gun like a small shelf. It is aligned
with the barrel and positioned so that when you grasp the
gun, your index finger will fit snugly up against it.
END VIEW
OOOO
OOOO
OOOO_____ <- Finger Rest
OOOO|
OOOO|
OOOO
OOOO
OOOO
OOOO
To use it:
1. You grasp the gun,
2. Point your index finger at the target, and
3. Shoot using your middle or left index finger.
That is all there is to it.
Additional information on P&S is available via e-mail or on
my web site: http://members.aol.com/okjoe/ps.htm
TEST RESULTS:
"Test" versions of the P&S Index Finger Rest were sent to
several people late last year. I followed up with questions
on how their test shoots went.
The questions I sent and the responses received to date are
below. They are sparse, but like other tests before them,
they prove that the P&S method of shooting and the P&S
Index Finger Rest in fact do work.
If you would like to get some "Test" versions for testing,
check out my web site for info.
********************
Questions Asked:
********************
A. Were you able to shoot fast, accurately, multiple times,
and instinctively using the "Test" P&S Index Finger Rest?
B. Would you recommend that other police agencies test
them?
C. Would you recommend that gun makers offer a frame
or grip that incorporates a P&S Index Finger Rest?
D. Any general or specific comments?
*************
Responses:
*************
I have shot using the P&S method. I have had varied results.
I shot 700 rounds using the method with my S&W 4506.
100 at 1 yard (quick draw...shoot from the hip)
100 at 3 yards double tap technique
100 at 5 yards 3 rounds in 5 seconds
100 at 7 yards 3 rounds in 5 seconds
100 at 10 yards
100 at 15 yards
100 at 25 yards
From 10 yards and under, I found that it was extremely
accurate... and to be honest... how many gun fights will you
get into at more than that?
At the 15 yard mark, I had trouble keeping the target, until I
canted the weapon to the left (I'm a righty shooter)... gangster
style... but not as much cant... maybe 45 degrees.
At the 25 yard mark, I had trouble hitting the target. I can see
the potential for this technique, but I guess I must practice it
at long range to become extremely accurate.
I think I would be a great idea to have this technique taught
at the police academies and also have the gun manufacturers
create a grip with the guide built in... but maybe not as wide
off the grip. Maybe a 1/4 inch off the gun... just using it as
support anyway.
**********
**********
I find no difference either myself or by students between this
training aid and using a frame characteristic. I tried glue-on
dots { they are used as non-abrasive feet for calculators etc.
and are 3/16" dia.} as a more acceptable, holsterable substitute.
They are just as successful in untrained hands.
2. If you made a test shoot:
A. Were you able to shoot fast, accurately, multiple times,
and instinctively using the "Test" P&S Index Finger Rest?
They [the students] could point shoot.
I cannot say I was but then I am an above average shot. I can
put 5 shots from a .357 into 3" at 7 yds in 2 seconds.
B. Would you recommend that other police agencies test
them?
As a training adjuct, why not.
C. Would you recommend that gun makers offer a frame
or grip that incorporates a P&S Index Finger Rest?
no
D. Any general or specific comments?
Point shooting is the sensible route to defensive use of pistol
at 5 yards or less. This is one way to teach point shooting.
It is not a practical carry gun alternative.
**********
**********
Here are some added comments of mine.
It is an odd quirk of the gun community, that handguns used
by the average shooter, are no different than those used by
the experts. Though the same can be said of the tools used
in other arenas, in other areans, your life most probably will
not be forfeited if you lose.
Police gunfight accuracy rates and police casualty rates cry
out for improvment in close quarters shooting methods and
means, or both. The P&S method and a P&S Index Finger
Rest provide such a response.
In a test I made with a "Test" P&S Index Finger Rest, I was
able to hit an 11 x 17 inch target at 25 feet, 6 out of 7 times
while shooting as fast as I could point my indexfinger at the
target and pull the trigger, and I hadn't shot a gun in over 40
years when I made the test.
A lot of people have said the P&S is bs, or that it just won't
work, etc.. However none of them have tried it or a P&S
Index Finger Rest. They must have crystal balls or some
other means of determining what works and what doesn't
by just thinking about it. No one who has tried either the
method or a finger rest has said they don't work.
A P&S Index Finger Rest can help to equalize the difference
between the expert and the average shooter, and increase
the shooting ability of one non expert shooter over another.
And what is true for gun professionals, is even more true for
the anxious home defender who may have bought a gun with
the thought in mind that in a high stress situation, when their
life was on the line, they would be able to use it effectively in
their self defense.
More info and rationales for using the P&S method and P&S
Index Finger Rests are available on my web site: http://members.aol.com/okjoe/ps.htm.
Will work for assault rifles too.