Gay marraige: its only a matter of time......

[rktman]

My understanding of Christianity probably dwarves what most people know of it. I grew up in a United Baptist church in eastern KY, have a father who converted to Catholicism, and attented a Methodist and Pentecostal church for a period of time. I know that the coming of Christ basically invalidated everything in the old testament and that his teachings are completely opposite of the stance that each of you bible thumpers are taking on this topic. Treat others the way you want to be treated. He who is without sin cast the first stone, and we've all sinned. What you do to the least among you, you do unto me. He accepted the leper, the prostitute and the criminals crucified on the crosses beside him. What makes you think you are so much more qualified to judge people than Christ? That's God's job and not your's. AND, some of the people in this country don't believe in God, as incomprehensible as that may be to you, and they have the same right as you to believe what they will. Hell, in their religion homosexuality may be the preferred union.

People pick and choose what they want from the Bible. If you believe it to be a literal representation of the word of God, then he is one sick puppy, So I'm leaning towards man having quite the influence on the MYRIAD translations that have taken place over 2000 years. Don't believe in evolution? Well I claim it doesn't conflict with the Bible... "But beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day." [2 PETER, 3,8].

Jesus's death washed the sins of everyone and they have but to accept his grace. All any gay person has to do is repent and he is just as good as you, and your approval or disapproval has absolutely no affect on that equation.

Your understanding of Religion may be greater than most but your understanding of Christianity is sorely lacking my friend.
I am certainly no expert, but you are not either if you don't even believe that the Bible is a true representation of Gods will due to translational differences. Then you quote one verse out of context to prove your point, not wise. Almost any verse in the Bible has to be read with those before and after to get what is being said.
You are certainly correct that Jesus's death paid the price for our sin and that repentance is a way that you acknowledge you have accepted Christ as Lord.
As a side note, please do not represent your personal beliefs as being the same as what Christ taught, they are not (at least not the way you worded your post).

A gay person (or any Sinner for that matter), who does not want to repent but wants the Bible/Church to change is not repenting.
I believe your intentions are good here, but we all need to have a clear understanding of what Gods word says on any matter before we try to establish ourselves as experts.
One more thing, everyone has an opinion, BUT opinions mean nothing. There is a Truth and all the opinions in the world will not change it.

[gpwasr10]

Knowing gpwasr10, I think he was being facetious.

The specter of "teh gay" persecuting Christians is a frequent fundy meme these days. Its more of a Freudian slip, showing what they would do to the gays if they ever got their way and turned America into a theocracy like Iran.

You saw through my ruse....

This "the ghays R gunna get Christians" thought process really is getting out of hand. if pedophile preachers didn't bring down Christ's house, a tax document provided by the state wont either.

Gay Marriage to the right is like gun ownership to the left. Neither have a realistic leg to stand on and both fights have their roots in fear.

[Ruskiegunlover]

....fear....and thousands of years of religious teachings all virtually the same accross judaism, islam, and christianity. Oh, and by the way, Christianity is the KINDEST to homosexuality as a sin. It is treated a lot less kindly by the religions the left LOVES..... Thousands of years, defined one way, until an extremely small number of people decided to use the issue politically.

[Kadmos]

Gay Marriage to the right is like gun ownership to the left. Neither have a realistic leg to stand on and both fights have their roots in fear.

Quoted for TRUTH!!!

[5.56NATO]

"I know that the coming of Christ basically invalidated everything in the old testament and that his teachings are completely opposite of the stance that each of you bible thumpers are taking on this topic."

Can you show me where and how? Messiah came to fulfill prophecy and the law, and not one jot or tittle will he change, and the laws about men laying with men as with women were pretty harsh. Let me also find the prophecy of hell for certain sins, it's from an ancient document that is most telling. Also, are you gay or bi? How is your relationship with your father?

From the Apocalypse of Peter:
(this is a glimpse of what hell will be like)
27 And other men and women were being burned up to their middle and cast down in a dark place and scourged by evil spirits, and having their entrails devoured by worms that rested not. And these were they that had persecuted the righteous and delivered them up.

28 And near to them again were women and men gnawing their lips and in torment, and having iron heated in the fire set against their eyes. And these were they that did blaspheme and speak evil of the way of righteousness.

29 And over against these were yet others, men and women, gnawing their tongues and having flaming fire in their mouths. And these were the false witnesses.

30 And in another place were gravel-stones sharper than swords or any spit, heated with fire, and men and women clad in filthy rags rolled upon them in torment. [This is suggested by the LXX of two passages in Job: xli. 30, his bed is of sharp spits; viii. 17, on an heap of stones doth he rest, and shall live in the midst of gravel-stones.] And these were they that were rich and trusted in their riches, and had no pity upon orphans and widows but neglected the commandments of God.

31 And in another great lake full of foul matter (pus) and blood and boiling mire stood men and women up to their knees And these were they that lent money and demanded usury upon usury.

32 And other men and women being cast down from a great rock (precipice) fell (came) to the bottom, and again were driven by them that were set over them, to go up upon the rock, and thence were cast down to the bottom and had no rest from this torment. And these were they that did defile their bodies behaving as women: and the women that were with them were they that lay with one another as a man with a woman.

33 And beside that rock was a place full of much fire, and there stood men which with their own hands had made images for themselves instead of God, [And beside them other men and women] having rods of fire and smiting one another and never resting from this manner of torment....

34 And yet others near unto them, men and women, burning and turning themselves about and roasted as in a pan. And these were they that forsook the way of God.

[LAGC]

32 And other men and women being cast down from a great rock (precipice) fell (came) to the bottom, and again were driven by them that were set over them, to go up upon the rock, and thence were cast down to the bottom and had no rest from this torment. And these were they that did defile their bodies behaving as women: and the women that were with them were they that lay with one another as a man with a woman.

WOO-HOO! Lesbian sex in hell? Do we get to watch?

[5.56NATO]

If you're there you'll be able to see it but I doubt if you will care much.

[demac777]

So all I can ask is if you guys are so incensed about this gay marriage ruling, why aren't you spouting off about Red Lobsters or JC Penney, or Gillette/Schick? What about Tattoo parlors or women who pierce their ears? All these things are forbidden right in Leviticus along with homosexuality. Can't eat shellfish or catfish. Can't wear mixed clothing or cut your beard. Can't cut or mark the body.

What about these little verses: Romans 13: 1-7
Let every person be subject to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those that exist have been instituted by God. Therefore whoever resists the authorities resists what God has appointed, and those who resist will incur judgment. For rulers are not a terror to good conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is good, and you will receive his approval, for he is God's servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword in vain. For he is the servant of God, an avenger who carries out God's wrath on the wrongdoer. Therefore one must be in subjection, not only to avoid God's wrath but also for the sake of conscience. ...

Or this... 1 Peter 2:13-17
Be subject for the Lord's sake to every human institution, whether it be to the emperor as supreme, or to governors as sent by him to punish those who do evil and to praise those who do good. For this is the will of God, that by doing good you should put to silence the ignorance of foolish people. Live as people who are free, not using your freedom as a cover-up for evil, but living as servants of God. Honor everyone. Love the brotherhood. Fear God. Honor the emperor.

Just wonder why these parts of the word of God aren't as important as the ones about homosexuality?

[demac777]

"I know that the coming of Christ basically invalidated everything in the old testament and that his teachings are completely opposite of the stance that each of you bible thumpers are taking on this topic."

Can you show me where and how? Messiah came to fulfill prophecy and the law, and not one jot or tittle will he change, and the laws about men laying with men as with women were pretty harsh. Let me also find the prophecy of hell for certain sins, it's from an ancient document that is most telling. Also, are you gay or bi? How is your relationship with your father?

From the Apocalypse of Peter:
(this is a glimpse of what hell will be like)
27 And other men and women were being burned up to their middle and cast down in a dark place and scourged by evil spirits, and having their entrails devoured by worms that rested not. And these were they that had persecuted the righteous and delivered them up.

28 And near to them again were women and men gnawing their lips and in torment, and having iron heated in the fire set against their eyes. And these were they that did blaspheme and speak evil of the way of righteousness.

29 And over against these were yet others, men and women, gnawing their tongues and having flaming fire in their mouths. And these were the false witnesses.

30 And in another place were gravel-stones sharper than swords or any spit, heated with fire, and men and women clad in filthy rags rolled upon them in torment. [This is suggested by the LXX of two passages in Job: xli. 30, his bed is of sharp spits; viii. 17, on an heap of stones doth he rest, and shall live in the midst of gravel-stones.] And these were they that were rich and trusted in their riches, and had no pity upon orphans and widows but neglected the commandments of God.

31 And in another great lake full of foul matter (pus) and blood and boiling mire stood men and women up to their knees And these were they that lent money and demanded usury upon usury.

32 And other men and women being cast down from a great rock (precipice) fell (came) to the bottom, and again were driven by them that were set over them, to go up upon the rock, and thence were cast down to the bottom and had no rest from this torment. And these were they that did defile their bodies behaving as women: and the women that were with them were they that lay with one another as a man with a woman.

33 And beside that rock was a place full of much fire, and there stood men which with their own hands had made images for themselves instead of God, [And beside them other men and women] having rods of fire and smiting one another and never resting from this manner of torment....

34 And yet others near unto them, men and women, burning and turning themselves about and roasted as in a pan. And these were they that forsook the way of God.

Look you guys are really having a hard time understanding this. I'm not disputing your beliefs. Believe what you want. My question is why you feel the need to force your beliefs on others in a nation of freedom to practice religion as you as an individual choose to, including practicing no religion? With regard to my personal beliefs on the subject, I've already expressed those here in this thread in other posts if you truly care to look?

[stinker]

WOO-HOO! Lesbian sex in hell? Do we get to watch?

So, we finally after all this time found a way to get you to convert?

[demac777]

The term most often used by the lukewarm fence walker who does not want his friends in the world to think less of him.
Coward.

All my friends respect me because I speak my mind and stay true to my beliefs regardless of the dissent, just as I've done here. Far from cowardly. I ask the question... If you are all so strongly committed to your beliefs, why aren't these other proclamations in the Bible just as important as the gay issue? Lot more people eating shellfish than having gay sex...

[5.56NATO]

This begins the long slide into legalised incest and etc. There's no diff between what is proposed as legitimate now and in the future when sister and brother will wed, mother and son, granny and grandson, bestiality marriages. The door is wide open for mindlessness. And why not?

[Kadmos]

This begins the long slide into legalised incest and etc. There's no diff between what is proposed as legitimate now and in the future when sister and brother will wed, mother and son, granny and grandson, bestiality marriages. The door is wide open for mindlessness. And why not?

Genetically damaged children.

There is a reason for the prohibition against incest, the huge risk of damaged kids.

You don't get that type of problem with gays.

[5.56NATO]

You're being very narrow minded and intolerant, bigoted, etc.

[Kadmos]

You're being very narrow minded and intolerant, bigoted, etc.

No, it's a matter of harm.

By the way, most countries don't criminalize incest between consenting adults.

[stinker]

Genetically damaged children.

There is a reason for the prohibition against incest, the huge risk of damaged kids.

You don't get that type of problem with gays.

How do you figure there's a huge risk?

In Utero testing for known syndromes is common as hell these days. If daddy knocks his daughter up and a doctor says it's gonna come out looking like a mutated Nancy Pelosi then the dems will be happy as hell to provide a "free" abortion at your local planned parenthood thrift shop 7 days a week with no questions asked. I could even see them passing a law making the testing mandatory when they finally get around to repealing all the incest laws.

Did you actually seriously think it was going any other way?
Even the repubes are completely on board with executing unborn babies that have grandpa and daddy as the exact same person.

As for beastiality marriages, no offspring is possible so so no harm can be done under that criteria, so who are you to judge one man or womans love for their puppy? They have rights to happiness too you know.

How dare you say Mary can't have a little Lamb if she wants to?

No, it's a matter of harm.

Not.

[Kadmos]

How do you figure there's a huge risk?

In Utero testing for known syndromes is common as hell these days. If daddy knocks his daughter up and a doctor says it's gonna come out looking like a mutated Nancy Pelosi then the dems will be happy as hell to provide a "free" abortion at your local planned parenthood thrift shop 7 days a week with no questions asked. I could even see them passing a law making the testing mandatory when they finally get around to repealing all the incest laws.

Did you actually seriously think it was going any other way?
Even the repubes are completely on board with executing unborn babies that have grandpa and daddy as the exact same person.

You still have the potential for harmed offspring. The reasons aren't the same as for gay marriage.

As for beastiality marriages, no offspring is possible so so no harm can be done under that criteria, so who are you to judge one man or womans love for their puppy? They have rights to happiness too you know.

How dare you say Mary can't have a little Lamb if she wants to?

Again, a non argument. Animals can't consent.

Still no slippery slope.

[Cypher]

Quoted for TRUTH!!!

Are you guys really trying to compare the 2nd amendment with gay people pretending to be married? If so that pretty much tells us all we need to know about your thought process.

[Kadmos]

Are you guys really trying to compare the 2nd amendment with gay people pretending to be married? If so that pretty much tells us all we need to know about your thought process.

Only in that the parties have hypocritical views concerning them.

Republicans shouldn't be arguing for government interference into personal freedoms, and democrats shouldn't be trying to take away choice concerning the 2nd amendment.

These two things are good examples of inconsistencies in the party platforms vs the ideologies.

[demac777]

You used a 'you' statement making some assumption that 'you' know what I believe...which I doubt n00b

Seems you are impressed with what your friends think. Perhaps what may be of more value is what Christ thinks. Point being your shellfish cliche suggests you haven't fully comprehended the difference between law and grace. But then again, somewhere in a previous post here I think you implied great knowledge because of your family church history. Odd...my grandpa was a pastor all his life but that didn't mean I was anything special.

As far as the gays and LAQCs amongst us, their behavior and choices are between them and the One they will eventually answer to. None of us can control the behavior of others unless we apply force, which in the end does not solve anything.

Why don't you explain the difference between "law" and "grace" oh great and riveting uber admin. And while you're at it, try to refrain from using ad hominem ("coward", "noob") attacks and directly address the point of my question. Never said I was special, just that the facts are in writing for anyone willing to apply logic over superstition for just a few moments.