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Thread: Minnesota Man Accused of Murdering Teens Who Entered His Home goes to Court

  1. #1
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    Minnesota Man Accused of Murdering Teens Who Entered His Home goes to Court

    The trial against a 65-year-old man accused of murdering two teens who entered his home is underway in Minnesota, stirring debate about how far people can go in defending their homes.

    Byron Smith, a retired security engineer for the U.S. Department of State, is charged with first-degree premeditated murder in the slayings of cousins Nick Brady, 17, and Haile Kifer, 16, on Thanksgiving Day 2012. The killings rocked the small city of Little Falls.

    “The problem is that Byron Smith fired multiple shots,” Abrams said. “You don’t have the right to execute an intruder. If he had fired one shot at each of these intruders, he’d have a much stronger defense.”

    http://gma.yahoo.com/minnesota-man-a...opstories.html





    Hmmm. So what's the accepted number for shooting a criminal with unknown intentions who just broke into your home?
    "And how we burned in the camps later thinking, what would things have been like, if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain, whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family?"

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    Team Guns Network Silver 04/2015 mrkalashnikov's Avatar

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    After reading the article I find it hard to really draw an informed opinion about it.

    I'd like to read/hear more about the two teen-agers, and the homeowner as well.

    Something about this story stinks to high heaven.

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    From what I gather the homeowner had been broken into before, by the same kid and possibly others.
    "And how we burned in the camps later thinking, what would things have been like, if every security operative, when he went out at night to make an arrest, had been uncertain, whether he would return alive and had to say good-bye to his family?"

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    Team GunsNet Silver 04/2014 El Jefe's Avatar

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    Anyone breaking into my home is committing suicide. Next time you hear someone bemoaning Castle or Stand Your Ground laws, you know you're listening to someone who cares more for thugs and criminals than they do decent people. They simply don't care if you're victimized. Hmmm.... sounds like Democrats to me.
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    Senior Member jet3534's Avatar

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    There are a lot of liberals in Minnesota. Liberals don't believe in self defense.

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    Administrator Krupski's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by 5.56NATO View Post
    The trial against a 65-year-old man accused of murdering two teens who entered his home is underway in Minnesota, stirring debate about how far people can go in defending their homes.

    Byron Smith, a retired security engineer for the U.S. Department of State, is charged with first-degree premeditated murder in the slayings of cousins Nick Brady, 17, and Haile Kifer, 16, on Thanksgiving Day 2012. The killings rocked the small city of Little Falls.

    “The problem is that Byron Smith fired multiple shots,” Abrams said. “You don’t have the right to execute an intruder. If he had fired one shot at each of these intruders, he’d have a much stronger defense.

    http://gma.yahoo.com/minnesota-man-a...opstories.html





    Hmmm. So what's the accepted number for shooting a criminal with unknown intentions who just broke into your home?
    Obviously doesn't apply when cops empty entire magazines into everything around them.
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    Administrator Krupski's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by jet3534 View Post
    There are a lot of liberals in Minnesota. Liberals don't believe in self defense.
    LOL! "Beliefs" won't stop a bullet.
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    Administrator imanaknut's Avatar

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    Several detectives that I know told me that it is not unusual for someone defending themselves to not know how many rounds they have fired, and in fact can empty a mag without realizing they fired more than one or two shots. Adrenalin does strange things to the body and mind.

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    Administrator Krupski's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by 5.56NATO View Post
    Hmmm. So what's the accepted number for shooting a criminal with unknown intentions who just broke into your home?
    Well I just now read the article......

    Then, according to court documents, Smith shot Brady [the boy] a third time in the face, allegedly telling investigators, “I want him dead.”

    Minutes later, Kifer [the girl] walked down the same steps, reportedly calling Brady’s name. Smith shot her multiple times, too – telling investigators the last time he fired was “a good clean finishing shot.”
    To me, that does not sound like self defense. Regardless of the local law, the decision to pull the trigger should only be made when a person's life is in immediate danger and there's no other choice.

    To blast one kid in the face a third time, and then to give the other kid a "finishing shot" sounds like pure murder to me.
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    Team GunsNet Silver 04/2014 El Jefe's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Krupski View Post
    Well I just now read the article......



    To me, that does not sound like self defense. Regardless of the local law, the decision to pull the trigger should only be made when a person's life is in immediate danger and there's no other choice.

    To blast one kid in the face a third time, and then to give the other kid a "finishing shot" sounds like pure murder to me.
    These fucks got what they went looking for. You raid a man's home, you deserve to die, its that simple.
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    Senior Member Kadmos's Avatar

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    Sounds like the guy is more than a bit "off".

    That said, for the boy's death, yeah I would probably go with not guilty. Kid broke in, snuck downstairs, I could see it being reasonable to shoot in most situations where a stranger has broken in.

    For the girl, sorry, but guilty. It sounds like she called out the homeowners name. It would be pretty likely that she came in to give him assistance, to help give medical attention to her cousin, etc. I think it seems like there may have been ample opportunity for him not to shoot, but to attempt to talk to her.

    BTW, this is the first I've heard of this case, and am just giving first impressions off what was said in the video.

    There are of course times where it's ok to break into a persons house, for example if it's on fire. But courts have also ruled its ok if you need to because you are freezing and stranded, etc.

    This is the downside of "shoot first and ask questions later". This could have been a neighbor who tried ringing the broken doorbell for half an hour and broke in because they thought maybe he was in medical trouble. (Obviously not this case, but I'm saying it happens).

    I'm not buying murder in the first or premeditated though. For that he would have had to lure them inside then kill them, in my opinion. Like calling someone up and saying "come on in when you get here" then shooting them and claiming you thought they were intruders.

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    Administrator imanaknut's Avatar

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    Then per the article it does appear that the guy knew what he was doing, and if you can believe the report it does appear that he executed a couple of thugs that sadly got what they deserved.

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    Team Guns Network Silver 04/2013 alismith's Avatar

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    "Minnesota Man Accused of Murdering Teens Who Entered His Home goes to Court"


    The OP says it all. It states the circumstances in which the event occurred.

    Smith did not lure them in. He did not invite them in. He didn't go chasing after them.

    They entered his home, uninvited. They were not guests.

    They were there with criminal intent. They put themselves in harm's way...and they got harmed!

    End of story.

    If I were on the jury, I'd find him innocent on both counts.
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    Senior Member jet3534's Avatar

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    A lot of people tout the 5.56 round for home defense over .33 9 pellet buckshot -- something I never believed. This case is a good example since this guy was initially using a Mini-14. Odd that it jammed.

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    Team GunsNet Silver 04/2014 El Jefe's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by jet3534 View Post
    A lot of people tout the 5.56 round for home defense over .33 9 pellet buckshot -- something I never believed. This case is a good example since this guy was initially using a Mini-14. Odd that it jammed.
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    Senior Member jet3534's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Krupski View Post
    Well I just now read the article......



    To me, that does not sound like self defense. Regardless of the local law, the decision to pull the trigger should only be made when a person's life is in immediate danger and there's no other choice.

    To blast one kid in the face a third time, and then to give the other kid a "finishing shot" sounds like pure murder to me.
    Sound to me like the reptilian brain kicked in as is often the case in these type situations. What you are calling murder I would call survival instinct.

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    Team GunsNet Silver 04/2014 El Jefe's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Krupski View Post
    Well I just now read the article......



    To me, that does not sound like self defense. Regardless of the local law, the decision to pull the trigger should only be made when a person's life is in immediate danger and there's no other choice.

    To blast one kid in the face a third time, and then to give the other kid a "finishing shot" sounds like pure murder to me.
    "Some folks just need killin."
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    What is it with minnesota, wisconsin and Iowa. They are not west coast urban states, yet they vote liberal time after time. The last time they voted properly was in the 1980s for Reagan.

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    Team GunsNet Bronze 07/2011 weevil's Avatar

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    No sympathy at all for the punks.........but it's obviously not a good idea to brag to the cops about "finishing" them off after they're down.


    Do what you gotta do but keep it to yourself......loose lips sink ships.


    Telling the cops you executed someone under any circumstances is never a good idea.
    Last edited by weevil; 04-22-2014 at 09:10 PM.

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    Team GunsNet Silver 04/2014 El Jefe's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by weevil View Post
    No sympathy at all for the punks.........but it's obviously not a good idea to brag to the cops about "finishing" them off after they're down.


    Do what you gotta do but keep it to yourself......loose lips sink ships.


    Telling the cops you executed someone under any cicumstances is never a good idea.
    True.
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