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View Full Version : Which one of us is related to the Iceman? Now we might be able to find out.



old Grump
08-07-2010, 12:18 AM
Scientists decode 5,200-year-old Iceman’s genes
Genetic data could point to ancient traits ... or modern relatives


© South Tyrol Museum of Archaeology
Researchers have sequenced Oetzi the Iceman's genome and hope to be able to locate any living descendants.
By Wynne Parry

updated 8/5/2010 1:48:58 PM ET
Oetzi the Iceman, the Neolithic mummy found accidentally in the eastern Alps by German hikers in 1991, has offered researchers all sorts of clues to life 5,200 years ago, from his goat-hide coat to the meat and unleavened bread in his stomach to the arrow wound in his shoulder.
http://msnbcmedia1.msn.com/j/MSNBC/Components/Photo/_new/100805-science-iceman-vmed-1040a.grid-4x2.jpg
Now scientists stand poised to find out a whole lot more about Iceman, who also goes by Frozen Fritz and Similaun Man.

They recently finished sequencing the Iceman's genome, which took about three months — a feat made possible by whole genome sequencing technology. With that map of his genes in hand, researchers are moving onto to a whole new array of questions, according to Albert Zink, head of the European Institute for Mummies and the Iceman at the European Academy of Bozen/Bolzano (EURAC) in Italy.

"Some are very simple, like so 'What was really the eye color of the Iceman? What was really his hair color?'" Zink said. There are more complicated questions, too. Zink and others are curious about any genetic evidence of disease in the Iceman and the composition of his immune system.

And there's the big one, he told LiveScience: "Are there any living relatives of the Iceman still around?"

Scientists have already taken a stab at this question when they analyzed DNA from Iceman's mitochondria energy-producing centers of cells and compared the results with groups of living individuals. They did not find any matches, suggesting that his maternal lineage is either very rare or died out. (Mitochondrial DNA is passed down from mothers to their children and so would only provide relatives on Iceman's mom's side of the family.)

"We have to take into account this is only the maternal lineage," he said, referring to the mitochondrial study. "And not all people are tested."

Until now, scientists hadn't mapped the DNA within the nuclei of his cells. For humans, nuclear DNA contains 6 billion base pairs, while mitochondrial DNA has only 15,000 to 17,000, according to Zink.

Collaboration with EURAC's Institute for Genetic Medicine is expected to widen the field, because it has collected genetic information on a large number of people living in the region, the most likely prospects for Iceman's descendants. That, in addition to the fact that scientists can compare his entire nuclear genome, gives Zink hope for getting to the bottom of some of Iceman's mysteries.

Iceman's genome was sequenced using a sample taken previously from his hip bone, Zink said.

Zink and a colleague from the Institute of Human Genetics at the University of Tuebingen were able to complete the genomic sequencing with amazing speed thanks to collaboration with Andreas Keller of the biotechnology firm Febit, according to Zink.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/38578491/ns/technology_and_science-science

It boggles me little mind how we keep finding out things supposedly lost for the ages. I hope they don't come up with a mind reading machine. There are things forgotten or should be forgotten that most of us hope never see the day of life again. Levity aside I find this whole exercise in studying the iceman fascinating and I can't wait to see what else they come up with.

I'd really like to see the results of the genome analysis and how it connects to modern man. Anybody missing a great great great great great grand uncle from their family tree. Anybody know how many greats it takes to go back 5,200 years. I'm guessing about 133 if you have another generation every 30 years but I'm probably being to conservative.

renegadebuck
08-07-2010, 12:23 AM
He doesn't look like you at all? :D

old Grump
08-07-2010, 01:52 AM
I was thinking maybe a Texan who had been out in the sun all morning without his hat.

swampdragon
08-07-2010, 02:05 AM
I think this type of thing is fascinating.

I'd like to know not just who may be a living descendant, but also where he came from too. Who were "his" distant relatives?

mriddick
08-07-2010, 03:15 AM
Screw being related to this loser, I'm hoping to be related to the guy who kicked his a$$ so hard the world is still talking about it 5,000 years later...

HDR
08-07-2010, 07:01 AM
Of all the exciting opportunities life offers somehow learning if I am related to the iceman failed to make even the long list..

lol

slamfire51
08-07-2010, 08:54 AM
I'm probably related since I love cold weather.

Full Otto
08-07-2010, 09:11 AM
It boggles me little mind how we keep finding out things supposedly lost for the ages.

Same here, seems the more they discover the more questions they have.
I caught just part of the NOVA program they're airing this month " Alien from Earth". Since I didn't see it all I may be wrong but you may find it good if you haven't seen it yet.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/hobbit/

http://www.kued.org/?area=pressReleases&action=details&id=NjAx
An ancient legend on the Indonesian island of Flores tells of an elflike creature similar to the fictional hobbit. But a controversial 2003 archeological find not only suggests that there could be some truth behind the legend, but promises to rewrite a key chapter in the human evolutionary story.

slamfire51
08-07-2010, 09:33 AM
Same here, seems the more they discover the more questions they have.
I caught just part of the NOVA program they're airing this month " Alien from Earth". Since I didn't see it all I may be wrong but you may find it good if you haven't seen it yet.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/hobbit/

http://www.kued.org/?area=pressReleases&action=details&id=NjAx
An ancient legend on the Indonesian island of Flores tells of an elflike creature similar to the fictional hobbit. But a controversial 2003 archeological find not only suggests that there could be some truth behind the legend, but promises to rewrite a key chapter in the human evolutionary story.

I caught that Nova episode, pretty interesting.

swampdragon
08-07-2010, 05:06 PM
If we're related to Hobbits, then I want my Ring of Power....my precious.

Mark Ducati
08-08-2010, 12:43 PM
Screw being related to this loser, I'm hoping to be related to the guy who kicked his a$$ so hard the world is still talking about it 5,000 years later...

"My ice-dad can beat up your ice-dad"?

old Grump
08-08-2010, 07:51 PM
"My ice-dad can beat up your ice-dad"?


Wednesday, July 05, 2006

Whoever it was probably lived a few thousand years ago, somewhere in East Asia — Taiwan, Malaysia and Siberia all are likely locations.

He — or she — did nothing more remarkable than be born, live, have children and die.

Yet this was the ancestor of every person now living on Earth — the last person in history whose family tree branches out to touch all 6.5 billion people on the planet today.

That means everybody on Earth descends from somebody who was around as recently as the reign of Tutankhamen, maybe even during the Golden Age of ancient Greece. There's even a chance that our last shared ancestor lived at the time of Christ.

"It's a mathematical certainty that that person existed," said science journalist Steve Olson, whose 2002 book "Mapping Human History" traces the history of the species since its origins in Africa more than 100,000 years ago.

It is human nature to wonder about our ancestors — who they were, where they lived, what they were like. People trace their genealogy, collect antiques and visit historical sites hoping to capture just a glimpse of those who came before, to locate themselves in the sweep of history and position themselves in the web of human existence.

But few people realize just how intricately that web connects them not just to people living on the planet today, but to everyone who ever lived.

With the help of a statistician, a computer scientist and a supercomputer, Olson has calculated just how interconnected the human family tree is.

You would have to go back in time only 2,000 to 5,000 years — and probably on the low side of that range — to find somebody who could count every person alive today as a descendant.

Furthermore, Olson and his colleagues have found that if you go back a little farther — about 5,000 to 7,000 years ago — everybody living today has exactly the same set of ancestors.
Related Stories

* Genealogist: Almost Everyone on Earth Descended From Royalty

In other words, every person who was alive at that time is either an ancestor to all 6 billion people living today, or their line died out and they have no remaining descendants.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,201908,00.html

Your ice dad and his ice dad were probably one and the same, that means all of you are my cousins. Blacksmith and Krupski are blood kin. Now they have to kiss and make up. :nono:

Unless my ancestors were late immigrants to Sweden and Norway they were probably living on or near the glacier in Northern Sweden after the last ice age. My French and Bohemian ancestors were probably moving up from the mideast or India. Best estimate at the moment is 5,000 years ago there weren't more than 50,0000,000 people on earth and until agriculture was started in Egypt there was no way to support large cities of 5,000 people or more, we were all hunter gatherers and then later farmers and craftsmen.

My dad was the first from my clan to leave the farm. I couldn't wait to get back to it. Drug the kid away from the dirt but couldn't drag the dirt out of the kid. :coffee:

Full Otto
08-08-2010, 08:17 PM
I think he was pole vaulting and the stick he was using snapped