First AK

[ugaarguy]

I'd always leaned toward that other rifle, probably because it was my first service type rifle, and a few years later I used one in the service. A manager at my LGS recently showed me an NHM-90 in 5.56 that they'd taken in on trade. Since it can share ammo with those other rifles I have, and I figured it was time for me to branch out into the AK world; I bought it. Test firing at the local range was flawless. The rifle ran great with both the original Chinese 30 rounder, and an Arsenal 5 round .223 mag (it was the only other .223 AK mag I could find locally).

I signed up here a few days ago, and started researching. I quickly realized that the rifle was sitting in at best a gray area, and worst not compliant, in regards to CFR-whatever-it-is that used to be 922(r). This NHM-90 had what appeared to be the original Chinese muzzle brake, plus what appeared to be Chinese forearm, pistol, grip, and buttstock. There were no US marked parts inside, uh-oh. I found the gun wiki 922(r) worksheet from links here, and used it as a guide to order US made parts from an online gun parts retailer. Thanks to posts here and elsewhere on the web I was able to get everything installed yesterday when the parts showed up. :D I've now correctly de-banned this NHM-90, and I can't wait to shoot it later today.

Thank y'all for the tremendous resource you've been.

[Schuetzenman]

LOL, welcome to Gunsnet.net and it's OK to say AR-15 in an AK forum. We won't ban you for typing it. You've got a kind of rare AK variant, not too many Chinese 5.56 chambered rifles in the US before all imports got cut off by Bill Clinton the liar n Chief.

If the 5 round Bulgarian mag is working in the NHM you should pickup a 30 round Bulgarian circle 10 marked mag and see if that works. If it does, get another 9 of them to have a proper number of mags to support your AK with.

[videodon]

...welcome...and enjoy your new rifle!
:)

[El Laton Caliente]

Nice pick for a first AK! Where are the pics?

[Full Otto]

I figured it was time for me to branch out into the AK world

Sounds like you hit the ground running
Welcome

[O.S.O.K.]

:welcome: to the board! Cool AK!!

Look forward to some pics when you get a chance and the range report!

Will second the comment on the Bulgy mags. They are probably the best quality polymer available.

[ugaarguy]

Thanks for the warm welcome. I've looked at the Bulgy mags online, and read of their excellent reputation. I've also read about here, and on some other general firearms forums, about the MSA & renegadebuck AR-15 mag adapters. Since I already have several PMags, and a pile of USGI mags, I've considered getting one of those. For the cost of 3 or 4 Bulgy mags, I could use the good stock of AR-15 mags I already have. However, I'm not sure I want it to lose its AK-ness.

[imanaknut]

Welcome to the group !!! :welcome:

And now the AK-addiction!!!

One of my two favorite AK variants for range trips is my 84S-1, the underfolder version of which is what the NHM90, MAK-90 and BWK-92 was before George Bush the First had a fit over his idea that how a firearm looked ("evil looking weapons") caused people to commit crimes.

The Chinese .223 mags are hard to come by, but several people have been able to use Bulgarians in their Chinese .223.

As for being 922(r) and Title 27 CFR 478.39 compliant, that only supposedly applies to the person doing the conversion, so if you bought the rifle in the pre-Bush condition, it isn't truly your problem.

Enjoy the start of your new addiction, post pix when you can, and again welcome to the site!

[binky59]

Welcome.......Now all you need is a couple more and lots of ammo!

[Schuetzenman]

Thanks for the warm welcome. I've looked at the Bulgy mags online, and read of their excellent reputation. I've also read about here, and on some other general firearms forums, about the MSA & renegadebuck AR-15 mag adapters. Since I already have several PMags, and a pile of USGI mags, I've considered getting one of those. For the cost of 3 or 4 Bulgy mags, I could use the good stock of AR-15 mags I already have. However, I'm not sure I want it to lose its AK-ness.

Well that is the good thing about that adapter. It doesn't alter your weapon permanently so you can always take it out and go back to stock mags. Your reason to get one I find sound given your magazine situation for AR platform rifles.

[ugaarguy]

The Tapco standard pistol grip worked as expected - it's a pistol grip, obviously not a complicated part. I went with a Tapco side folder because it cost the same as most other US made fixed stocks, and I can't put a side folder on an AR-15. Tapco's stocks have come a long way in the past few years. Their side folder was quite sturdy, and surprisingly comfortable while firing.

That brings us to the other compliance parts. I bought a Tapco G2 dual hook trigger group. Thankfully I opted for the kit with the retaining plate. I tried using the shepherd's crook, but after much cussing, I grabbed the retaining plate. After minor fitting, the retaining plate lined up, and the trigger group passed all function tests. The rifle did have some new found bolt sluggishness when firing. A tear down & cleaning tonight revealed drag marks on the hammer face. I pulled the hammer out, and grabbed the original Chinese hammer from the parts bin. Using the original as guide, I contoured & polished the Tapco hammer to match.

I ordered a Tapco flash hider to round out my compliance parts. I also ordered a Tapco piston just in case I had problems with another part. Well, the flash hider was phosphated inside & out - including the threads. Despite padding the pliers jaws, I tore up the exterior finish on the darn thing cutting through the phosphate on the internal threads. Erring on the side of caution I went ahead and installed the Tapco piston. Getting the original piston out was a son of you know what. I was debating using red loctite, but my friend who works at the range told me to bring the piston back tomorrow. The range's owner is a very good machinist, and my friend there said the owner's drilled & pinned several US made pistons replicating the original style work. I'll have the range owner do his magic on the piston, and probably try a home refinish on the flash hider.

My friend at the range also found a spare Pro-Mag Saiga .223 30 rounder. We realized that it was very similar to the 5rd Bulgy mags I had on hand. I gave him a few bucks for the mag, and we proceeded to modify it to run in the NHM-90. I did a little more work tonight once I got home, and I think I've finalized the fit. I've never been a fan of Pro-Mag products, but this actually looks to have decent, if not pretty darn high quality, construction.

I've heard grill paint, or engine enamel are good options for refinishing small parts like flash hiders, but I'm open to suggestions if y'all have any. The wood fore end also looks out of place on the rifle now that it has a black stock & pistol grip. Any recommendations on a new fore end are appreciated.

I'll follow up again tomorrow with another range report.

[l921428x]

You will fit fine here with no tweaking, Enjoy!

[EddieB310]

I purchased an unfired norinco 84 full stock with three 30 round chinese mags and bayo on Gunbroker last week for $750. Just missing the box. I placed one bid and didn't expect to win it. It was listed as a norinco ak74, so I guess it didn't get many looks.:smile:

[imanaknut]

ugaarguy, just a note that the gas piston of the AK is supposed to be slightly loose on the carrier. The correct installation is to thread it is until it just barely starts to tighten, then back off one quarter to one half turn. The pin that holds it in place should be tight in the carrier, but loose in the piston.

You really didn't need to go that far, but if it makes you feel less vulnerable to black helicopters and black Chevy Blazers then at least you will sleep better. :)

[ugaarguy]

ugaarguy, just a note that the gas piston of the AK is supposed to be slightly loose on the carrier. The correct installation is to thread it is until it just barely starts to tighten, then back off one quarter to one half turn. The pin that holds it in place should be tight in the carrier, but loose in the piston.
I noticed that on the original piston, but thank you for confirming it to me.


You really didn't need to go that far, but if it makes you feel less vulnerable to black helicopters and black Chevy Blazers then at least you will sleep better.
LOL, my old room mate actually drives a black Chevy Suburban - with blue lights & US Gov't. plates. He called me yesterday, and I was telling him about the AK parts that arrived. He's in training to be a field a level firearms instructor with agency he works for, and yesterday was AK day for them. He appreciated the coincidence. Lucky guy, he gets to spend two weeks shooting guns, and he's getting paid for it. Also, he was a civilian handgun instructor prior to becoming a LEO. He's very pro gun, and looking to get back into civilian instruction on the side soon. So, I'm not worried about government helicopters & black SUVs.

Lightly modifying guns is a hobby I enjoy. The piston may have been over the top, and although it was a PITA to get out, I did feel a great sense of accomplishment in completing the task. Plus, Tapco is in my home state, so I'm good with spending a few extra bucks with them. :)

[ugaarguy]

As requested, here are a few pics of the new toy.

803 804 805

http://www.gunsnet.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=803&d=1312530715

http://www.gunsnet.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=804&d=1312530715

[Schuetzenman]

Looks good and since you have taken it that far, I agree you should go ahead and replace the handguards with black polymer. Your post about you home state finally decoded your user handle for me UGA, AR, Guy. You might notice I'm also here in GA.

[El Laton Caliente]

Pics look good. I might have gone with the Ace folder, but the Tapco seems nice enough.

Watch gunbroker for Chinese mags, they show up every now & then.

[ugaarguy]

Schuetzen, I did notice that you're "in the area" so to speak. Thanks for the positive comments on the work I've done so far.

El Laton, the Tapco stock was a pleasant surprise. My friend at the local range is a bit older & wiser, and has been in firearms retail for over a decade. He even commented that Tapco has come a long way in the past decade or or so. I'll keep y'all up to date on how it holds up to continued use.

[ugaarguy]

I was looking at the Cope's Dist website last night, and saw that the piston pin is actually a rivet (according to them), and is 3mm in diameter. It hit me in the head like a ton of bricks - I have a riveting tool! Well, 3mm is .118", and 1/8" is, obviously, .125". Well, 7 thousandths of an inch isn't enough to worry about when you're expanding a rivet anyway. I'd already drilled the Chinese rivet out with a 1/8" bit anyway, and it measured so close to the pin hole that it looked to be the right bit then. So, I shimmed up the piston & carrier in the vise to prevent the piston from walking, and drilled the Tapco piston to match the Chinese carrier. A 1/8" diameter by 1/2" long pop rivet fit's perfectly. I then sanded the ends to blend it to the carrier. I'll be off to test fire shortly. Best case scenario is it works perfectly. Worst case scenario is that I have to drill it again, order a $1 & change correct rivet from Cope's, and install that. It's a win either way.

[imanaknut]

Added your photos of your rifle for those of us who don't like clicking on links.

Looks good!!!

One of the nice things about the NHM90 was they left the muzzle threaded, so installing a standard 84S bird cage style flash hider is a simple process.

I believe Apex has US made copies. I have seen them in several places. Used to be impossible to find the 84S hider, but lucky for those of us who appreciate the Chinese AK, US made hiders have shown up in number.

[ugaarguy]

Added your photos of your rifle for those of us who don't like clicking on links.

Looks good!!!
Thank you, and thank you.

One of the nice things about the NHM90 was they left the muzzle threaded, so installing a standard 84S bird cage style flash hider is a simple process.
If this is the correct 84S flash hider (http://www.cncwarrior.com/comersus/store/comersus_viewItem.asp?idProduct=33) then I accidentally ordered the correct style item. The supply house where I ordered the rest of the Tapco parts was out of Tapco's M16A2 style AK flash hider, so I ordered this (http://www.tapco.com/products/ak/index.php?_a=viewProd&productId=53) instead. The Tapco hider linked is the one I tore the exterior finish off of cutting through the finish on the interior threads. As an experiment, I sprayed it with some Rustoleum black truck bed liner paint I already had on hand. I put the Chinese muzzle brake back on while I went to the range, and let the Tapco hider dry.

The piston mod worked perfectly. The remainder of the mandrel fell out of the rivet during test firing, and is, I assume, sitting on the floor of the range - 'cause it sure ain't in the rifle. The rivet body stayed in, and it's there to stay. :D The 15 round Chinese mag, despite a fresh spring, doesn't like to feed the next to last round. The original 30 rounder ran like a champ, as did all three Bulgy 5 rounders. The Saiga ProMag, despite my best efforts, just sits too high in the receiver - ohh well. The rifle is running quite well with good mags though.

Now to get a handguard, and a Bulgy circle 10 mag - or an AR mag adapter.

Edit to add: Does anyone know where I can find a gas block (original or repro) with the bayonet lug?

[imanaknut]

Chances of finding a gas block with bayo lug, and the front sight with the cleaning rod holder, well let's say you would have a better chance buying a lottery ticket and winning! They are just this side of impossible to find, and I can't believe nobody makes imitation replacement parts.

Can't tell from your photos, but this is a close match to the true 84S hider:
https://www.apexgunparts.com/images/AK47/AK0687.jpg

Photo thanks to Apex Gun Parts, a site sponsor!

[ugaarguy]

Chances of finding a gas block with bayo lug, and the front sight with the cleaning rod holder, well let's say you would have a better chance buying a lottery ticket and winning! They are just this side of impossible to find, and I can't believe nobody makes imitation replacement parts.
K-Var has Bulgy front sights (http://www.k-var.com/shop/product.php?productid=16354&cat=290&page=1) with the cleaning rod holder. The ID is .590" on the Bulgy, but my NHM-90 bbl. is mic'ing at .660" - darn it.

[ugaarguy]

Apex has the Bulgy front sights as well, I see. AKnut, the flash hider I bought is a dead ringer for the one from Apex you posted a picture of. That's cool that a part outage actually caused me to order a more correct replica part. Apex has some other AK front sights & gas blocks as well. I'll have to e-mail them and check to see if any of those parts have IDs close to the NHM-90 barrel's OD.

[Schuetzenman]

I was looking at the Cope's Dist website last night, and saw that the piston pin is actually a rivet (according to them), and is 3mm in diameter. It hit me in the head like a ton of bricks - I have a riveting tool! Well, 3mm is .118", and 1/8" is, obviously, .125". Well, 7 thousandths of an inch isn't enough to worry about when you're expanding a rivet anyway. I'd already drilled the Chinese rivet out with a 1/8" bit anyway, and it measured so close to the pin hole that it looked to be the right bit then. So, I shimmed up the piston & carrier in the vise to prevent the piston from walking, and drilled the Tapco piston to match the Chinese carrier. A 1/8" diameter by 1/2" long pop rivet fit's perfectly. I then sanded the ends to blend it to the carrier. I'll be off to test fire shortly. Best case scenario is it works perfectly. Worst case scenario is that I have to drill it again, order a $1 & change correct rivet from Cope's, and install that. It's a win either way.

Rivet, pin, rivet-pin. You can use a roll pin and flare it out at either end. I favor a simple finishing nail. Using a ball pean hammer I hammer the nail head into a dome then tap it to fit the coutour of the carrier some what. Then flip it all over, trim off the excess nail length leaving about .100 sticking up past the surface. Using the ball end of the hammer I then forge the end into the couter sink I've put in the O.D. of the carrier. To keep from driving the nail back out, which it would do easily, I pack it up against the anvil surface on my bench vice. Dress with a file to match countours better then repaint carrier. In my case I use Gun Kote by KG industries which gets baked on at about 300 degrees F.

[imanaknut]

Apex has the Bulgy front sights as well, I see. AKnut, the flash hider I bought is a dead ringer for the one from Apex you posted a picture of. That's cool that a part outage actually caused me to order a more correct replica part. Apex has some other AK front sights & gas blocks as well. I'll have to e-mail them and check to see if any of those parts have IDs close to the NHM-90 barrel's OD.

Assuming you find parts that fit, the only problem with using European front sights on a Chinese AKM is the Chinese had a full hoop protection around the front sight pin. The Europeans just used the standard "dog ear" protectors.

On the other hand, the milled Poly Tech Legend did use the dog ear style front sight protectors, and also happened to use the same barrel O.D. as the Bulgarians.

[ugaarguy]

Assuming you find parts that fit, the only problem with using European front sights on a Chinese AKM is the Chinese had a full hoop protection around the front sight pin. The Europeans just used the standard "dog ear" protectors.
Danged if ya do, darned if ya don't huh? These things are addictive with all the intricate details.

[ugaarguy]

I picked up an Israeli FAB Defense hand guard, so now all the furniture is matching black plastic. I also reinstalled the 84S type Tapco flash hider now that I've refinished it. The truck bed liner paint isn't the prettiest finish on the flash hider; but it's functional, and the matte black is a decent match for the new furniture.

814 815 816
http://www.gunsnet.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=814&d=1312689739
http://www.gunsnet.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=815&d=1312689739
http://www.gunsnet.net/attachment.php?attachmentid=816&d=1312689739

[blade]

:welcome:Love the Chinese varients!!!!!!!

[dja9520]

SWEET!!!!