Legal question

[stinker]

At what point does ATF want a person to have an FFL if you were buying, fixing up and reselling rifles/pistols?

Example, hit a pawn shop and buy some abused junker bolt rifle. Take it home and do a fit and finish, maybe a trigger job, recrown and any necessary function repairs to make it "like new" or better again. Three options at that point. Keep it, sell it in a private transfer or flip it back to an FFL.

My thinking is as a means of getting some smithing experience and a work portfolio(resume with pictures;)) and having it mostly pay for itself.

[Helen Keller]

WHy not get a FFL for Gunsmithing/Manufacturing???

[stinker]

WHy not get a FFL for Gunsmithing/Manufacturing???

Money, time and geography at the moment. I'm still living out in this truck so i don't have an address to put on an ffl. I'm going to be switching jobs soon though to get something that keeps me closer to home either daily or every few days at the most. Then i actually could just go that route, but until i have a permanent address something tells me the atf wil not be too happy with "travelling gun salesman" on the application.

In between the rootless lifestyle and getting my own place i could start messing with it since i'll have access to all my dads tools though so wondering what the boundaries are. I got a lot of work before i can even remotely be able to call myself "gunsmith" though. In the meantime it's something to do.

[circuits]

At what point does ATF want a person to have an FFL if you were buying, fixing up and reselling rifles/pistols?


The minute you're buying with the intent to fix up and resell, ATF considers it manufacturing, and requires you to have an FFL.

Fixing up guns for your personal use, later tiring of them or just needing some money, and reselling them is fine.

I don't know that ATF will ever "come after" you if you keep the volume low, but when you're doing it to make a profit, it's a business and the law requires you to have (in this case) a manufacturer FFL Type 07.

[stinker]

The minute you're buying with the intent to fix up and resell, ATF considers it manufacturing, and requires you to have an FFL.

Fixing up guns for your personal use, later tiring of them or just needing some money, and reselling them is fine.

I don't know that ATF will ever "come after" you if you keep the volume low, but when you're doing it to make a profit, it's a business and the law requires you to have (in this case) a manufacturer FFL Type 07.

It was a nice pipe dream while it lasted then :toke:

The point would'nt really be profit so much as practice that does'nt cost me money but that'll make no difference if someone did decide to "come after" me for doing it so i'm not going to try to split hairs and parse definitions on that one. Is 07 the one that lets you manufacture and keep non-transferrable to civie nfa items from scratch? That would at least be a nice side perk that would make it worth the trouble.

[Schuetzenman]

WHy not get a FFL for Gunsmithing/Manufacturing???

As of 2005 it didn't exist. 01 FFL is what is required and that is the generic can sell any weapon other than NFA stuff license.

To Stinker, In my opinion you should hold it to less than one weapon per month. Never show up at a gun show with a table of weapons to sell unless you have the 01 license. If you really want to be a gunsmith there are degrees in it from some universities. NRA can send you a list of who offers these.

[stinker]

As of 2005 it didn't exist. 01 FFL is what is required and that is the generic can sell any weapon other than NFA stuff license.

To Stinker, In my opinion you should hold it to less than one weapon per month. Never show up at a gun show with a table of weapons to sell unless you have the 01 license. If you really want to be a gunsmith there are degrees in it from some universities. NRA can send you a list of who offers these.

Was'nt even considering the gunshow table scale. More like go buy one or maybe two and fiddle with them until they're purdy then flip them back to a dealer and buy/trade for one or two more. Like i said, more like a self sustaining hobby scale for now was my thinking. I'm going to be in tool buying mode as i go to start off with too so i'm talking slow process anyways due to my funds being somewhat limited at the moment. Getting out of this truck and reestablishing myself in such a way that i can at least pretend i have a life is going to be an expensive endeavor given that i'm basically starting from scratch. I don't have squat besides some basic hand tools in storage right now.

A proper course and degree is another thing on my consideration list too as well as some proper machinist courses like cnc programming and welding training if i go the degree route and go pro. I've done production scale fastener modification work once upon a time in a shop long long ago so it's not a huge leap to working with small gun parts really.

[binky59]

I can't say that I have considered what is or isn't the letter of the law on gunsmithing
I don't consider what I do gunsmithing, by repairing, refinishing other peoples guns
I don't have any paperwork and it's their gun. If I purchase a firearm, fix it up, then
decide that I don't want to keep it, I don't sweat the details, after all what is considered
a straw purchase? What length of time do I have to own the firearm before I can sell it?
I am not a lawyer but have one that will fight if I have to go to court. My advice is keep
what you do face to face, and word of mouth, if you're good, you won't need to advertise,
the work will come to you.