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O.S.O.K.
07-12-2012, 09:01 AM
I've seen some posts on other boards where people are asking "what gun to buy if obummer wins the election?".

Well, my reply was don't wait... get what you need now if you need it.

And my second comment was that I'd probably buy some decent NV equipment/compatible sighting as that's one hole in my prepps.

Being able to operate at night is a huge tactical advantage...

So, you guys that are UP on this please give some input at to what to look at.

L1A1Rocker
07-12-2012, 04:21 PM
I've seen some posts on other boards where people are asking "what gun to buy if obummer wins the election?".

Well, my reply was don't wait... get what you need now if you need it.

And my second comment was that I'd probably buy some decent NV equipment/compatible sighting as that's one hole in my prepps.

Being able to operate at night is a huge tactical advantage...

So, you guys that are UP on this please give some input at to what to look at.

I went with a 5 power Gent II+ rifle scope. I should have done it diffirently. Get a good Gen II or better one power that can be used in multiple applications. Something that could be attached to headgear so you can operate hands free at night but could also be attached to your rifle in combination with a scope would be much better.

O.S.O.K.
07-12-2012, 06:55 PM
That's what I was thinking.... go with a personal NV unit(s) and just be sure to have enough NV compatible sights.

Bluntforce, I agree to have that covered but I think being dark capable is also very important if you've got the basics covered...

American Rage
07-12-2012, 07:49 PM
I'm focusing on simple things like revolvers. I figure once the commie in chief signs over our rights, they'll be in big demand for the futhure.

Viking350
07-12-2012, 08:59 PM
I've seen some posts on other boards where people are asking "what gun to buy if obummer wins the election?".

Well, my reply was don't wait... get what you need now if you need it.

And my second comment was that I'd probably buy some decent NV equipment/compatible sighting as that's one hole in my prepps.

Being able to operate at night is a huge tactical advantage...

So, you guys that are UP on this please give some input at to what to look at.

What type of threat do you believe you will employ your nv capabilities against?

O.S.O.K.
07-13-2012, 09:39 PM
What type of threat do you believe you will employ your nv capabilities against?

Uh, the kind that comes at night. Obviously. :)

Ask yourself what will transpire if obummer wins the election. Ask yourself what he's already done and what he will do if he's got nothing to lose politically.

About the only thing that I am really deficient in is the capability to sight my weapons at night. That's a hole in the armor.

Viking350
07-14-2012, 07:31 AM
Uh, the kind that comes at night. Obviously. :)

Ask yourself what will transpire if obummer wins the election. Ask yourself what he's already done and what he will do if he's got nothing to lose politically.

About the only thing that I am really deficient in is the capability to sight my weapons at night. That's a hole in the armor.

So you think nv will help you against a well armed and trained military or law enforcement? One man?

FunkyPertwee
07-14-2012, 12:48 PM
Illuminated optics and detachable flashlight mounts can be a cheaper way to give yourself night capabilities.

old Grump
07-14-2012, 02:24 PM
Gonna buy me a bullet for my gun...hmmm, maybe I should get one of them there new fangled guns where you can load more than one bullet at a time. :think:

O.S.O.K.
07-15-2012, 02:56 PM
So you think nv will help you against a well armed and trained military or law enforcement? One man?

Where are you getting that?

If you would like to make a case for being unprepared, that is fine, but you are attempting to take this thread OT.

So, comment on the topic or find some other post to comment in. The question at hand is what NV equipiment do you recommend?

Or at least in general, what kind of configuration... personal or weapons mounted... that kind of thing.

O.S.O.K.
07-15-2012, 02:59 PM
Illuminated optics and detachable flashlight mounts can be a cheaper way to give yourself night capabilities.

Well, yes but it doesn't replace the NV.

I was hoping that replies would be more towards suggested equipment or configurations. :)

O.S.O.K.
07-15-2012, 03:05 PM
Gonna buy me a bullet for my gun...hmmm, maybe I should get one of them there new fangled guns where you can load more than one bullet at a time. :think:


Yes Grump. That would be a good start, though I believe that your Garand qualifies as such... :coffee:

AK-J
07-16-2012, 11:01 AM
I am not qualified to "recommend" something, as I have very limited first-hand knowledge.

However, I was recently looking into night vision myself. After some online research/shopping, I've decided that a monocular like the ATN NVM-14. It's just so versatile. It can be used as a hand-held unit, or with various accessories, it can be head mounted or mounted behind your existing weapon scopes.

As far as which Gen to go with. I've never been a fan of Gen I, they just aren't impressive at all. Personally I'd go with a Gen 3 if I could afford it, and I'm seriously considering the new "White Phosphor Technology". It seems to have the resolution of a Gen 3 but the picture is black and white vs. black and green. It seems like it would be easier for my eyes to pick up the contrast better. But I'm no expert.

O.S.O.K.
07-16-2012, 11:17 AM
Sounds reasonable. Have you sourced these? Have a vendor to recommend?

I think a head-mount unit would be the best - can get you around hands free and then allow you to sight your compatible optics as well.

The weapons mounted type are great but limited to that gun and not feasible for using to maneuver or spot things on the move.

AK-J
07-18-2012, 10:52 AM
I guess it really depends on what you intend to use it for. Tactically, it might be best to use it with a hands free head mount. For taking down some hogs or coyotes after dark, an adapter mounting it behind your weapon sight would probably be best. Because the particular unit I'm interested in is modular like that, one could adapt the NV to the job one intends. When I get my NV (won't be for awhile, got other things more important to spend money on right now), I'll be getting the accessories to do both.

As to where to pick it up... I've had good luck with Opticsplanet.com. They tend to have things cheaper than most places, free shipping on orders over a certain amount, and they ship it out pretty fast (if it is in stock). It's where I bought my Vortex Viper PST rifle scope.

sevlex
09-07-2012, 10:38 PM
Pulsar Digisight N550 Digital Night Vision Riflescope 76316

Have you looked at one of these? It works in daylight & is equivalent to Gen2.

http://www.opticsplanet.com/pulsar-digisight-n550-digital-night-vision-riflescope.html

Specifications for Pulsar Digisight Digital Night Vision Scope:
Generation: Digital Magnification: 4.5x
Objective lens diameter: 50mm
Field of view: 5.2 angular degrees
Eye relief: 67mm
Exit pupil: 6mm
Resolution: 50 lines per mm
Max. detection range, normal night time conditions (quarter moon): 400 yards
Diopter setting: +-3.5 diopter
Close-up range: from 5 yards to infinity
Power Supply: 6 Volt (4 x AA)
Input Power Supply: 3.7-6 Volts DC
Water intrusion rating: IP46 (IEC 60529)
Operating Temperature: -10 to +35 degrees C (+14 to +95 degrees F)
Dimensions: 13.4 in. x 3.7 in. x 3.7 in.
Weight: 33.5 oz. (2.1 lbs.)
Operating time (without/with IR): 12 hours / 9 hours

Features of Pulsar Digisight Digital Night Vision Riflescope:

Durable night vision rifle scope
Magnifies 4.5 times
Built-in IR illuminator
Numerous quick and easy functions
USB port
Video in/out port
Screen brightness adjustment

O.S.O.K.
09-09-2012, 11:20 AM
Thanks AKJ and another Opticsplanet recommendation. No, haven't check that... yet - but I like the versatility of the NVM-14...

O.S.O.K.
09-09-2012, 11:29 AM
$3K ouch. That's a nice and versitile monocular but wow - more than I can spend. The $1300 products are even stretching but I know NV is pricey.

You'd think somebody would come up with a good 2Gen package deal for under $1K... monocular, headgear and stantag mount.

L1A1Rocker
09-09-2012, 05:35 PM
$3K ouch. That's a nice and versitile monocular but wow - more than I can spend. The $1300 products are even stretching but I know NV is pricey.

You'd think somebody would come up with a good 2Gen package deal for under $1K... monocular, headgear and stantag mount.
Prices on NV gear seems to be on the increase. IIRC I paid around 1400 for my genII+ scope. It's now around 1600 for an equivilant. I suspect that our continuied wars has something to do with that.

El Laton Caliente
09-09-2012, 11:00 PM
I keep avoiding this subject. What it came to is keeping up with the Jones... Anyone else operating at night is likely to have NV also. If it is a Gen 3 or 4, and you are using a 1 or 2 with IR illumination it is as bad as shining a large flashlight around.

To get into gear that doesn't require suplimental IR you are into Gen 3 or 4 and the price runs into the $5K range.

My conclusion was Gen 1 & 2 are great for pig hunting, but not for any serious fire fight.

L1A1Rocker
09-15-2012, 09:28 AM
I keep avoiding this subject. What it came to is keeping up with the Jones... Anyone else operating at night is likely to have NV also. If it is a Gen 3 or 4, and you are using a 1 or 2 with IR illumination it is as bad as shining a large flashlight around.

To get into gear that doesn't require suplimental IR you are into Gen 3 or 4 and the price runs into the $5K range.

My conclusion was Gen 1 & 2 are great for pig hunting, but not for any serious fire fight.

You 100% right. I was thinking of this this morning and came looking for this thread to address just that.

If you do get the NV stuff make sure it is usable without IR lights. We've got some day/night security cameras on the property that use the IR lighting to work. Through the NV scope those camera's look like giant green flood lights - very easy to see.

The most I can/could afford at the time was the Gen II+ that works OK without the IR light. Most of the time I dont bother with the IR light because on a night with lots of stars out it really is not needed. BUT, on a clowdy night it needs a bit of illumination.

Don't get any of the Gen 4 (or "filmless") night vision. The amplifyer tubes do not last very long and are very prone to breakage. Also, remember to turn on your NV equipment once a month for 10 or 15 minutes. Not powering them up can cause them to go bad.

Durangokid
09-15-2012, 05:10 PM
I was thinking of glass bottles filled with gasoline and liquid soap with a rag atttached. But with the price of gas I don't know?

buxman66
09-16-2012, 05:20 PM
I was thinking of glass bottles filled with gasoline and liquid soap with a rag atttached. But with the price of gas I don't know?
Wtf? I thought this topic was on nvg? Lol good topic and also a good read,thanks!

Penguin
09-16-2012, 09:22 PM
I have often wondered about these,

http://www.xenonics.com/SuperVision/

Last time I really looked at night vision I looked into these. They looked pormising at the time but I don't think the technology was quite there yet. They were said to have frame rate issiues and trouble when going from different levels of light. Given how foar electronics keep comming though, any one know if these are any good?

O.S.O.K.
09-17-2012, 10:13 AM
I couldn't find a price on the super vision....

And the previous replies made me think.... is there a type of ilumination that can't be seen by NV? I mean if somebody's got NV goggles on - and you have ilumination that they can't see... that would be a viable alternative if it's inexpensive. You could have this illumination set-up with motion sensors for instance. They'd be tooling along with their NV and not even realize that they're standing under a light and clearly visible.

Penguin
09-17-2012, 08:03 PM
Last time I looked into this the super vision was running around 1200. Which if it is all it is cracked up to be, sounds like a great price. I am just not sure it is as great as they make out. I don't want to spend the 1200 bucks or so to find out that it isn't that great.

operator61
10-26-2012, 12:14 AM
So you think nv will help you against a well armed and trained military or law enforcement? One man?

I recently read an article about that very subject. What can one person with a handgun do against a trained military? While I don't remember the whole article the gist of it was, if one person with a handgun takes out one lone military person then he has access to that persons rifle and ammo. Now he has a handgun and rifle and ammo or grenades etc.. Now he can either arm others or take out other larger targets at longer ranges, before long one person with a gun turns into an army.
The article was written by a former U.S. special forces expert in guerrilla warfare about how one person with a gun can change the course of a war then compared that with all the civilian owned guns in America and made a strong case for just one person with a gun. He also gave many historical examples such as Vietnam and Afghanistan and how just a few people with a gun stopped whole Armies such as the Russians in Afghanistan.
So yes, one person with a gun can make a huge difference.

O.S.O.K.
10-27-2012, 09:48 AM
Good point there.

And when you think about how many people are already very well armed in this country... well...

slamfire51
10-27-2012, 11:04 AM
My thoughts on IR illuminated scopes/goggles would paint on Hell of a target on you, especially if the bad guys are using NV.
If I were to get a NV device, it would be a 'starlight' (?) type that amplifies ambient light.

O.S.O.K.
10-27-2012, 02:57 PM
I think you can turn the IR illuminator off? That'd basically give you a stealthy NV...

I won't be doing anything about this for a long time - so many expenses with the new place... I still don't have my office/reloading room set up yet...

Not that I'm bitchin :) We love it here. And the wife just got a job - hoping that works out well - 100% commision sales though. But the plan is for all of her take-home to go into a mortgage sinking savings account. We want to be able to retire someday in the foreseeable future!

Bluntforce
10-27-2012, 03:17 PM
Better not to have an IR device in your passive system in the first place. It may get accidentally turned on and you are lit up. Passive thermal sights would solve your problem if you're in a small group w/o the "here I am" beacon.

slamfire51
10-27-2012, 05:40 PM
I think you can turn the IR illuminator off? That'd basically give you a stealthy NV...

I won't be doing anything about this for a long time - so many expenses with the new place... I still don't have my office/reloading room set up yet...

Not that I'm bitchin :) We love it here. And the wife just got a job - hoping that works out well - 100% commision sales though. But the plan is for all of her take-home to go into a mortgage sinking savings account. We want to be able to retire someday in the foreseeable future!

I'm no expert on NV, but my 4 outdoor security cameras have NV w/IR illumination and the range is approx 50'. At dusk when there is still some determinable daylight and before the IR bulbs activate, everything is visible, especially things that have a light source. After the complete loss of natural light, nothing can be seen EXCEPT things with lights like cars, porch lights and security lights on power poles.

So turning off NV goggles or scopes that depend on IR will make it impossible to see bad guys unless they have IR illumination or flashlights.

slamfire51
10-27-2012, 05:55 PM
As daylight wanes here, I am taking pics of my security monitor as day light is lost to show what is visible and what is not after dark.

Will post pics after dark.

slamfire51
10-27-2012, 07:10 PM
As you can see, NV without IR is pretty useless, unless there is a light source on the bad guys.


1st pic. still some daylight.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/Canis-latrans/DCP_1683.jpg

Daylight waning. NV kicking in.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/Canis-latrans/DCP_1684.jpg

All NV with very, very little natural light visible.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/Canis-latrans/DCP_1686.jpg

Total darkness.
Security light as seen in lower left pic above.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/Canis-latrans/DCP_1688.jpg

Car headlights in upper left. +or- a quarter mile away. Light on ground is light from the kitchen.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/Canis-latrans/DCP_1689.jpg

O.S.O.K.
10-27-2012, 07:52 PM
Hmmm. Thanks for that. I guess you just have to spend some $$$ to get the real deal. And as I said....

El Laton Caliente
10-27-2012, 08:25 PM
Why I've avoided it... If you want real NV, you are spending what .gov does, about $3k to$5K...

O.S.O.K.
10-27-2012, 09:14 PM
ouch

El Laton Caliente
10-27-2012, 09:25 PM
Yep...

Schuetzenman
01-03-2013, 03:47 PM
IR illuminators are for when you're inside and there is no starlight or street light glow to use in magnifying to creat an image. Any Night vision device less than a Gen 2+ is about useless from what I've seen. They have gen 4 now, but I had read about some reliability issues with Gen 4 amplifier tubes burning out early. Gen 3 seems to be the best and most reliable.

It all costs big money some bigger than others. Then there's Thermal Vision.