You will never see this on MSM...

[coppertales]

if it is true...... From the World Health Organization
The latest Murder Statistics for the world: Murders per 100,000 citizens

Honduras 91.6
El Salvador.................................... 69.2
Cote d'lvoire.................................. 56.9
Jamaica........................................ 52.2
Venezuela...................................... 45.1
Belize........................................... 41.4
US Virgin Islands............................. 39.2
Guatemala..................................... 38.5
Saint Kits and Nevis......................... 38.2
Zambia......................................... 38.0
Uganda......................................... 36.3
Malawi.......................................... 36.0
Lesotho......................................... 35.2
Trinidad and Tobago........................ 35.2
Colombia....................................... 33.4
South Africa................................... 31.8
Congo........................................... 30.8
Central African Republic................... 29.3
Bahamas....................................... 27.4
Puerto Rico.................................... 26.2
Saint Lucia..................................... 25.2
Dominican Republic.......................... 25.0
Tanzania....................................... 24.5
Sudan........................................... 24.2
Saint Vincent and the Grenadines....... 22.9
Ethiopia......................................... 22.5
Guinea.......................................... 22.5
Dominica....................................... 22.1
Burundi......................................... 21.7
Democratic Republic of the Congo...... 21.7
Panama........................................ 21.6
Brazil............................................ 21.0
Equatorial Guinea............................ 20.7
Guinea-Bissau................................ 20.2
Kenya........................................... 20.1
Kyrgyzstan.................................... 20.1
Cameroon..................................... 19.7
Montserrat..................................... 19.7
Greenland...................................... 19.2
Angola.......................................... 19.0
Guyana......................................... 18.6
Burkina Faso.................................. 18.0
Eritrea.......................................... 17.8
Namibia........................................ 17.2
Rwanda......................................... 17.1
Mexico.......................................... 16.9
Chad............................................ 15.8
Ghana........................................... 15.7
Ecuador........................................ 15.2
North Korea................................... 15.2
Benin............................................ 15.1
Sierra Leone.................................. 14.9
Mauritania..................................... 14.7
Botswana...................................... 14.5
Zimbabwe..................................... 14.3
Gabon........................................... 13.8
Nicaragua...................................... 13.6
French Guiana................................ 13.3
Papua New Guinea.......................... 13.0
Swaziland...................................... 12.9
Bermuda....................................... 12.3
Comoros....................................... 12.2
Nigeria.......................................... 12.2
Cape Verde.................................... 11.6
Grenada........................................ 11.5
Paraguay....................................... 11.5
Barbados....................................... 11.3
Togo............................................. 10.9
Gambia......................................... 10.8
Peru............................................. 10.8
Myanmar....................................... 10.2
Russia........................................... 10.2
Liberia.......................................... 10.1
Costa Rica..................................... 10.0
Nauru............................................. 9.8
Bolivia........................................... . 8.9
Mozambique.................................... 8.8
Kazakhstan..................................... 8.8
Senegal.......................................... 8.7
Turks and Caicos Islands.................... 8.7
Mongolia......................................... 8.7
British Virgin Islands.......................... 8.6
Cayman Islands................................ 8.4
Seychelles....................................... 8.3
Madagascar..................................... 8.1
Indonesia........................................ 8.1
Mali.............................................. .. 8.0
Pakistan.......................................... 7.8
Moldova.......................................... 7.5
Kiribati.......................................... .. 7.3
Guadeloupe..................................... 7.0
Haiti............................................. .. 6.9
Timor-Leste..................................... 6.9
Anguilla.......................................... . 6.8
Antigua and Barbuda......................... 6.8
Lithuania......................................... 6.6
Uruguay.......................................... 5.9
Philippines....................................... 5.4
Ukraine........................................... 5.2
Estonia........................................... 5.2
Cuba.............................................. 5.0
Belarus........................................... 4.9
Thailand.......................................... 4.8
Suriname........................................ 4.6
Laos.............................................. . 4.6
Georgia.......................................... 4.3
Martinique....................................... 4.2
United States of America................... 4.2

ALL the countries above the United States of America have 100% gun bans

[TEN-32]

This is very good information. Have you vetted this?

[Kadmos]

Oh good, we aren't quite as murderous as Georgia and Laos, but Turkmenistan, Palestine and Djibouti have a bit less than us.

Here's one, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, and Iraq have half of our murder rate with about 2.0 murders per 100K

Qatar, Oman, Saudi Arabia, and Serbia, cut that in half again.

So woo hoo, we beat out most of the third world!

Uk 1.2
Italy 0.9
Spain 0.8
Germany 0.8
France 1.1
Japan 0.4
Hong Kong 0.2
China 1.0


There really isn't much we have to be proud of on that list

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate

[ready]

Well if the numbers are correct it shows that the murder rates the media loves to show everyone are not coming from the United States as a people but from a very small sect of society. I would love to see the numbers of how many murders are criminals killing other criminals.

Then they can subtract that number from any debate they want to have.

[Richard Simmons]

So woo hoo, we beat out most of the third world!

There really isn't much we have to be proud of on that list



How about this list? any prouder?

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/hea_abo-health-abortions

[Kadmos]

How about this list? any prouder?

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/hea_abo-health-abortions

Hell no.

That's sad as all get out.

[Oswald Bastable]

Oh good, we aren't quite as murderous as Georgia and Laos, but Turkmenistan, Palestine and Djibouti have a bit less than us.

Here's one, Jordan, Kuwait, Lebanon, and Iraq have half of our murder rate with about 2.0 murders per 100K

Qatar, Oman, Saudi Arabia, and Serbia, cut that in half again.

So woo hoo, we beat out most of the third world!

Uk 1.2
Italy 0.9
Spain 0.8
Germany 0.8
France 1.1
Japan 0.4
Hong Kong 0.2
China 1.0


There really isn't much we have to be proud of on that list

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_intentional_homicide_rate

Yup, we have a higher murder rate than other western countries, but what is somewhat surprising, those rates (per 100K) have remained nearly unchanged over the last 15 years or so, as have those of the other western countries.

For example:

Homicide rate per 100K in the UK, any method:

2009: 1.1
2008: 1.2
2007: 1.4
2006: 1.3
2005: 1.3
2004: 1.5
2003: 1.7
2002: 2.0
2001: 1.7
2000: 1.6
1999: 1.5
1998: 1.5
1997: 1.4
1996: 1.3
1995: 1.5
1992: 0.55

Homicide rate per 100K in the US, any method:

2011: 5.15
2010: 5.27
2009: 5.48
2008: 5.86
2007: 6.10
2006: 6.22
2005: 6.13
2004: 5.93
2003: 6.11
2002: 6.13
2001: 7.13
2000: 5.96
1999: 6.05
1998: 5.19
1997: 6.79
1996: 7.3
1995: 8.1
1993: 9.93

While there have been ups and downs over the time periods the stats come from, all in all, they are relatively similar, for their respective countries.

The real question is, why is it so much higher in the US than in the UK (or other European countries) and I think a case can be made for the fact that we have many more large urban population centers than any given European country. And that's where the majority of murders take place.

Edited to add sources:

http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/england-and-wales

http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/united-states

[ready]

Its ironic to me that the same ideologists that create the neighborhoods that account for 90% of our violence are the same people that want to force their solution down the rest of our throats.

[Kadmos]

The real question is, why is it so much higher in the US than in the UK (or other European countries) and I think a case can be made for the fact that we have many more large urban population centers than any given European country. And that's where the majority of murders take place.



I don't know about that

The US has an area of 3,700,000 square miles and a population of 315 million

The UK has 94,000 square miles and a population of 63 million

that means the US has about 87 people per square mile whereas the UK has 660 people per square.

Europe is much more densely populated than we are.

I'd say we have a lot more people living in rural areas than Europe in general.


Looking it up it seems Europe has an area of about 3.9 million square miles, not much larger than the US, and a population of 740 million, much larger than the US, well over double the US in fact, and if we were the average the rates it would still have the US 3-4 times higher in murders.

Using small numbers like 2 or 4 murders per 100,000 doesn't make it seem like much, but that's something like 200% more murders

[Oswald Bastable]

I don't know about that

The US has an area of 3,700,000 square miles and a population of 315 million

The UK has 94,000 square miles and a population of 63 million

that means the US has about 87 people per square mile whereas the UK has 660 people per square.

Europe is much more densely populated than we are.

I'd say we have a lot more people living in rural areas than Europe in general.


Looking it up it seems Europe has an area of about 3.9 million square miles, not much larger than the US, and a population of 740 million, much larger than the US, well over double the US in fact, and if we were the average the rates it would still have the US 3-4 times higher in murders.

Using small numbers like 2 or 4 murders per 100,000 doesn't make it seem like much, but that's something like 200% more murders

There is a density of human beings that seems to exacerbate foul action on their part...I think the real boon to man would be for scientists to determine what that density is...and for all humans to be encouraged to live just outside of such density concentrations...to maintain their basic sense of sanity and humaneness. Animal studies have shown how quickly instinct dependent creatures degrade under enforced density...and yet we feel our humanity insulates us from those same foibles...to our detriment.

[btcave]

http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/homicide/race.cfm

We are on par with europe if you compare white with white.

I'm not a race guy, but facts are facts.

[Kadmos]

There is a density of human beings that seems to exacerbate foul action on their part...I think the real boon to man would be for scientists to determine what that density is...and for all humans to be encouraged to live just outside of such density concentrations...to maintain their basic sense of sanity and humaneness. Animal studies have shown how quickly instinct dependent creatures degrade under enforced density...and yet we feel our humanity insulates us from those same foibles...to our detriment.

I don't disagree at all.

But what's up with Greenland, probably the least densely populated country in the world with 4 times our murder rate.


We are on par with europe if you compare white with white.

I'm not a race guy, but facts are facts.

I'm not sure in what way race has what to do with it, but I think it is a factor.

My main thought is race likely contributes as a culture clash, we aren't a homogenous country, we have all kinds of people here and that creates friction

[Kadmos]

Its ironic to me that the same ideologists that create the neighborhoods that account for 90% of our violence are the same people that want to force their solution down the rest of our throats.

It's not at all ironic, it actually makes perfect sense.

The people with the biggest problem are the ones who want to find the solution the most.

It's not coincidence or some liberal conspiracy that the urban centers end up toughest on guns, they are the ones who have the most problems "caused" by guns. It's a simple matter of the squeaky wheel getting the grease.

[Oswald Bastable]

But what's up with Greenland, probably the least densely populated country in the world with 4 times our murder rate.


If your balls were that cold for that many months of the year, you'd be a mite peckish yourself. :)

[Oswald Bastable]

It's not at all ironic, it actually makes perfect sense.

The people with the biggest problem are the ones who want to find the solution the most.

It's not coincidence or some liberal conspiracy that the urban centers end up toughest on guns, they are the ones who have the most problems "caused" by guns. It's a simple matter of the squeaky wheel getting the grease.

I thought urban density wasn't really the problem...

[Kadmos]

I thought urban density wasn't really the problem...

Lol.

I meant that as Europe has the same issue with urban density as we do, possibly even more so.

I did not mean to imply that the bulk of murders aren't happening in urban areas, which I certainly believe they are.

I do think it's cities that have the real crime problems, therefore it's cities that generally enact the strictest laws in general....having the city come down on you for not painting your soffits or mowing your lawn frequently enough is likely more about crime prevention (friction reduction between closely packed neighbors) than it really is about property values.

[ready]

It's not at all ironic, it actually makes perfect sense.

The people with the biggest problem are the ones who want to find the solution the most.

It's not coincidence or some liberal conspiracy that the urban centers end up toughest on guns, they are the ones who have the most problems "caused" by guns. It's a simple matter of the squeaky wheel getting the grease.

It might make perfect sense to you but it sounds like a mental deficiency to me. They need to look in mirror instead of blaming everyone else for their failed social experiments.

[Krupski]

Yup, we have a higher murder rate than other western countries, but what is somewhat surprising, those rates (per 100K) have remained nearly unchanged over the last 15 years or so, as have those of the other western countries.


Here's that data in graphical form:

United States
http://www.gunsnet.net/photopost/data/500/medium/US_DAT.jpg


United Kingdom
http://www.gunsnet.net/photopost/data/500/medium/UK_DAT.jpg


Notice how the US crime rate soared when Klinton's AWB expired.....