The Vatican and Aliens? (not a joke)

[swampdragon]

I ran across this video just posted last month. (SEP 2010)
It's not one of those fake you-tube things.
It had me asking myself some weird questions.....

"Why" would the Vatican give a damn either way about aliens unless they actually believed in them?
Or, perhaps even had some secret "proof?"

To rephrase this:

If there is no such thing as aliens...no proof of aliens...and no belief in aliens...then why would the Vatican even bring it up at all in the first place?
Why wouldn't they declare it blasphemy instead?
Or better yet, just completely ignore the topic as silliness and dismiss it completely?

Are the Annunaki coming in 2012 and this is the reason for the Vatican's high level of secrecy for all these years?

(insert twilight zone music)

:conf44:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=57r4SfPPL-g&feature=related




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CAryL8e8fu8&feature=related

[LAGC]

I think the Vatican is still smarting from Galileo.

They're nervous about the increasing scientific discoveries that make it more and more likely that we are not alone in this vast universe. They don't want to be caught with their britches down again, so they're trying to co-opt science (albeit, controlled) for their own ends, "just in case" we are ever visited by space aliens.

The funny thing is, if we were ever visited, I imagine the aliens would have their own religious beliefs, so it would be interesting to see who is baptizing who. Indeed, I could see aliens trying to use the Church, co-opting its teachings, to try to spread some sort of "hybrid" faith, that mixes their own legends and teachings into Catholic doctrine. Or maybe the aliens will have out-grown religion altogether. Who knows.

[swampdragon]

That really is a good question and/or point.
The whole Galileo thing I mean.

"Could" it be that the whole concept of blasphemy was really an attempt to hide the truth on purpose for as long as possible...yet they (the church) knew all along that aliens were real?

Nephlim vs Annunaki vs angels vs demons, etc.
Perhaps really all one and the same?
The Bible just rewrites old Sumerian history?

And why only such a small blip in the Bible about Nephlim?
Yet, the Book of Enoch was banned outright?
Strange.
It's like the Bible assumes everybody knows who the Nephlim are, so saw no need to go into detail about them?
Weird.

[swampdragon]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UsEUYkh2Gpg&feature=related

[Ronwicp]

Vicodin is great!
That is all.

I'm gonna go watch Aliens now.

I think the answer to all your questions are in this quote from another thread.

[Oswald Bastable]

I think the answer to all your questions are in this quote from another thread.

LOL...beat me to it Ron. Not to mention he's debating with LAGC as if LAGC had the intelligence of a bread crumb...

:D

[swampdragon]

I think the answer to all your questions are in this quote from another thread.


:laugh::laugh::laugh:

I'm just sayin' that the Vatican talking about baptizing aliens is pretty damned weird...lol

[HDR]

LOL...beat me to it Ron. Not to mention he's debating with LAGC as if LAGC had the intelligence of a bread crumb...

:D

I figured the Vicodin kicked in; so maybe Oswald is right and Swampy was figuring if he gathered enough bread crumbs a conversation was possible?

[Arnulf]

I can just see the pope greeting the aliens aka "mars attacks" and they incinerate him.

[HDR]

I can just see the pope greeting the aliens aka "mars attacks" and they incinerate him.


I can see 0bama bowing to kiss their hand and incinerating and somehow the mental image just feels so right..

[Arnulf]

I can see 0bama bowing to kiss their hand and incinerating and somehow the mental image just feels so right..


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsXnK0ouTL8

[swampdragon]

I figured the Vicodin kicked in; so maybe Oswald is right and Swampy was figuring if he gathered enough bread crumbs a conversation was possible?

I wasn't looking for a whole loaf.
Just maybe a crumb muffin or something.
Besides, this is coming from the Vatican, not me...lol

[mriddick]

The Catholic church has a tradition of pondering things, for some reason they feel a need to explain and plan for everything even those things beyond their calling in the Bible. I guess it comes from centuries of being not only a religious power but the only political one too. This is why they have created such a huge amount of dogma, this I think is just more of the same.

Basically I think you have a bunch of smart guys, doing very little except thinking who come up with alot of stuff most of us would never have the time or desire to even think about.

[swampdragon]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsXnK0ouTL8

hahahahahaha

The aliens probably figured the pigeon was gonna crap on their car.

[Penguin]

And why only such a small blip in the Bible about Nephlim?
Yet, the Book of Enoch was banned outright?
Strange.
It's like the Bible assumes everybody knows who the Nephlim are, so saw no need to go into detail about them?
Weird.

What are Nephlim? What is the book of Enoch?

[swampdragon]

What are Nephlim? What is the book of Enoch?

Here's a good video.
It's short and to the point without being boring...



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PaGwwWRorLY



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ek4F65iqQBk&feature=related

[matshock]

Here's the thing- what if the first alien species we make contact with is just as complex as ours is? i.e. multiple religions, cultures, etc?

The idea that some secular monolithic force of enlightenment and change is going to descend on us seems pretty unlikely to me.

What if one of their major faiths is basically the same thing as Catholicism or more broadly Christianity?

I can already tell you what will happen- those with faith will respond with faith, a few will be moved to conversion and many will just say "Well, this just shows that religion is a natural construct of evolving intelligence and doesn't prove anything."

Faith is faith.

[HDR]

Besides, this is coming from the Vatican, not me...lol

Well, as there is relatively very little waste in nature, it does seem that reserving the whole universe to wait eons for us is a tad wasteful... Maybe the Vatican is just being prepared for the eventually of someday meeting aliens?
lol

The end of days isn't here either yet so many prepare for it.....

[Infidelski]

I'm going to need more ammo :)

[HDR]

Here's the thing- what if the first alien species we make contact with is just as complex as ours is? i.e. multiple religions, cultures, etc?

Then some might have new allies and for sure others will have someone new to hate or at least talk about... lol



Faith is faith.

Add the freedom to choose which faith and you have it. :D

[Cypher]

LOL...beat me to it Ron. Not to mention he's debating with LAGC as if LAGC had the intelligence of a bread crumb...

:D

Hey!!! Don't insult bread.

[bubagun]

Well, this was educational.

[Penguin]

Here's a good video.
It's short and to the point without being boring...



Cool thanks that is some interisting stuff.

[El Jefe]

I wasn't looking for a whole loaf.
Just maybe a crumb muffin or something.
Besides, this is coming from the Vatican, not me...lol

Printertard isn't going to be happy that you're using his material.

[swampdragon]

Cool thanks that is some interisting stuff.

Yep. I think so too.
And examples like this is why...


Here's the thing- what if the first alien species we make contact with is just as complex as ours is? i.e. multiple religions, cultures, etc?

The idea that some secular monolithic force of enlightenment and change is going to descend on us seems pretty unlikely to me.

What if one of their major faiths is basically the same thing as Catholicism or more broadly Christianity?

I can already tell you what will happen- those with faith will respond with faith, a few will be moved to conversion and many will just say "Well, this just shows that religion is a natural construct of evolving intelligence and doesn't prove anything."

Faith is faith.

Matshock is 100% correct when he states that people will react in different ways.
Think about the Aztecs and Cortes.
Or the Incas, or the Mayans.

Hell, the Mayans predicted their own destruction.
That's why people lay credence to their calendar and the whole 2012 deal in the first place.
Is it real?
Or is it "faith?"
And does "faith" generate self-fulfilling prophecies that other wise would not have happened?
Who knows?

Why would the Book of Enoch be banned from the Bible if it was all just "faith" based anyways?
Yet still leave a mention of the Nephlim in Genesis for all to see?
Doesn't make sense.

[Arnulf]

Goliath who was 9ft tall was a descendant of the Annakim giants.....and the little shepherd boy David killed him with a slingshot.

[swampdragon]

Goliath who was 9ft tall was a descendant of the Annakim giants.....and the little shepherd boy David killed him with a slingshot.

Does the Bible mention the Annunaki when speaking of Goliath?
I don't remember?
Hmmmm.

[Penguin]

Beats me I have never read it. I tend to find legends and such interisting though.

[Arnulf]

Does the Bible mention the Annunaki when speaking of Goliath?
I don't remember?
Hmmmm.

Yes it does....I cannot remember where its at.....I think it was when King Davids son Absalom usurped the thrown and David was hiding out in Goliaths home town?

[HDR]

Does the Bible mention the Annunaki when speaking of Goliath?
I don't remember?
Hmmmm.

I looked up Annunaki

"In that it is said that they appear to be the so-called ‘aliens’ who came to earth around 6000 yrs. ago

The word: ‘Annunaki’ whose top god was called ‘Anu’ -does not appear in the Bible. And it’s a controversial subject."

http://mystagogue.org/annunaki/biblical-speaking-what-does-the-wordname-annunaki-mean

I should have figured...

[Arnulf]

In the Hebrew Bible, there are a number of other words that, like "Nephilim", are sometimes translated as "giants":

* Emim

the fearful ones

* Rephaim

the dead ones

* Anakim

the [long]-necked ones

Anakim (or Anakites) are the descendants of Anak, and dwelt in the south of Canaan, in the neighbourhood of Hebron. In the days of Abraham, they inhabited the region afterwards known as Edom and Moab, east of the Jordan river. They are mentioned during the report of the spies about the inhabitants of the land of Canaan. The Book of Joshua states that Joshua finally expelled them from the land, excepting a remnant that found a refuge in the cities of Gaza, Gath, and Ashdod. The Philistine giant Goliath, whom David[44] later encountered, was supposedly a descendant of the Anakim.

The land, through which we have gone to spy it out, is a land that devours its inhabitants, and all the people that we saw in it are of great height. And there we saw the Nephilim (the sons of Anak, who come from the Nephilim), and we seemed to ourselves like grasshoppers, and so we seemed to them.

[swampdragon]

In the Hebrew Bible, there are a number of other words that, like "Nephilim", are sometimes translated as "giants":

* Emim

the fearful ones

* Rephaim

the dead ones

* Anakim

the [long]-necked ones

Anakim (or Anakites) are the descendants of Anak, and dwelt in the south of Canaan, in the neighbourhood of Hebron. In the days of Abraham, they inhabited the region afterwards known as Edom and Moab, east of the Jordan river. They are mentioned during the report of the spies about the inhabitants of the land of Canaan. The Book of Joshua states that Joshua finally expelled them from the land, excepting a remnant that found a refuge in the cities of Gaza, Gath, and Ashdod. The Philistine giant Goliath, whom David[44] later encountered, was supposedly a descendant of the Anakim.

The land, through which we have gone to spy it out, is a land that devours its inhabitants, and all the people that we saw in it are of great height. And there we saw the Nephilim (the sons of Anak, who come from the Nephilim), and we seemed to ourselves like grasshoppers, and so we seemed to them.

That was quite informative.
Thanks man!
It gives me some more stuff to look up.

There is another story or interpretation about Noah too.
Supposedly, he was spared from the flood because he proved he and his family were not descended from the Nephlim after they mixed with humans.
It had more to the story than just his love for God.
Gonna have to look for that too.

[Arnulf]

That was quite informative.
Thanks man!
It gives me some more stuff to look up.

There is another story or interpretation about Noah too.
Supposedly, he was spared from the flood because he proved he and his family were not descended from the Nephlim after they mixed with humans.
It had more to the story than just his love for God.
Gonna have to look for that too.

I never heard that about Noah...but I have read about David and Goliath many times.....get out your Bible and look up Elijah and Elisha and Ezekiel....ufologists always debate those stories in the Bible as close encounters.

[Full Otto]

I never heard that about Noah

I have just recently actually. Has to do with keeping the bloodline pure from Adam to Christ to be able to fulfill one of the two prerequisites to prove His (lawful) right to claim who He said he was. The Nephlim if left unchecked would have destroyed that bloodline.
Something like that anyway

[Arnulf]

I have just recently actually. Has to do with keeping the bloodline pure from Adam to Christ to be able to fulfill one of the two prerequisites to prove His (lawful) right to claim who He said he was. The Nephlim if left unchecked would have destroyed that bloodline.
Something like that anyway

Thanks Otto. :)

[swampdragon]

by Estelle Nora Harwit Amrani
November, 1998

from Vibrani Website

recovered through BibliothecaAlexandrina Website





The caduceus is one of the most ancient of symbols. You might best know this symbol as the DNA structure and healing used by the medical profession. Since ancient Mesopotamia the caduceus presented two serpents intertwined (the central nervous system) around a staff (the spinal column) with the wings (the "swan") on either side (the two hemispheres of the brain, with the circle in the center representing the pineal gland, or the central sun and psychic center within). It also symbolized the kundalini energy.

This was originally the symbol for the Anunnaki-Sirian creator god, EA, or EN.KI (who has become an Archetype), was the chief of the magicians, "the one who knows," and infamous for being the serpent of the Garden of Eden who created lifeforms in test tubes half a million years ago with his half-sister Ninharsag, at the suggestion of his son, Marduk, to create humans to be the workers for the gods. (The symbol is also based upon the winged globe for the planet Nibiru, the symbol of the royal Anunnaki family.)

Biblical writers called the healing serpent Nehushtan. The Hebrew word for serpent is "nahash." The root of the word are the Hebrew letters Nun, Het and Shin, which means "to guess." This was translated into other languages as "satan," which some say mean "enemy," or "adversary."

Enki’s identity, as Lord of Earth or In Earth (EN.KI), also known as EA ("whose house is water") is reflected in other names, as well:

*

Adonai
*

Ptah
*

Aton
*

Aten
*

Adom
*

Adam
*

Amen

(Linguistic paleontology is a marvelous and vast area for proving these connections.)



The name EARTH also comes from EA/Enki. Actually, the name "earth" can be traced to Enki (a.k.a. EA), and "human" is related to Ninharsag/Ninhursag, who was Hathor (the House of Horus): HU (Horus) is also a transliteration of the ancient Sumerian EA (Grimms’ law of interchangeable letters and sounds). If we use Hebrew, HU means "she."

India, the "nagas" were the serpent gods and goddesses. In the Americas there was Quetzlcoatl (or Thoth). The entire world has worshipped the serpent for its wisdom, but ironically, it was not really about snakes at all - unless you feel you have to "guess" what a snake is up to! Why was the snake chosen? For its cleverness, ability to survive in the harshest of environments, and again, its shape resembling the flow of energy up the spine - to the crown chakra, and the third eye. The snake sheds its skin and is reborn. The snake is clever. And perhaps because it naturally instilled a bit of caution or awe in people. Was Enki really a snake? Not literally. He has many different appearances.

The serpent always represents spiritual wisdom, life and healing. The first symbols of serpents were attributed to Enki and then Ninhursag. However, the story of the serpent becoming an evil symbol began with the wars between Enki and his brother, Enlil (later known by the name "Allah"). These conflicts began at birth and had to do with birthright to the royal throne of the Nibiruan civilization in which their father, Anu, was the leader and father to Enki and Enlil. There was a time when Anu felt Enki (due to his wisdom and magical abilities) was the only savior of the Anunnaki people ("Enuma Elish").



This story later was reflected in Cain and Abel, and all the stories throughout your times of brothers competing for power, favoritism and inheritance. Enlil’s anger with Enki caused him to twist the truth around to make the serpent evil, which later became what you know as the story in the Bible. What you think of as being Satan is not that at all, but THE REVERSE!

Although there was love between Enki and Enlil, they often did not see eye to eye on many issues, especially when it came to supporting human beings. Enlil never had patience or compassion for people, and on several occasions, Sodom and Gomorrah as one example, he literally nuked them out of existence. He attempted this again during the time of the Great Flood but Enki (and those who supported him) took swift action to alert the Noahs around the planet of the forthcoming dangers. Some of the Anunnaki outraged with Enki for doing so but saw they had little choice in finally carrying out the rescue. Anu supported saving humanity.

In the Garden of Eden situation, Enlil was furious that Enki permitted humans to have access to knowledge, the mixing of the Anunnaki with human genes, thereby becoming more "godly," and equal to the Anunnaki. To strike back at Enki, and in the attempt to regain his power over humans, Enlil vowed to tarnish Enki’s reputation by spreading the idea that the serpent of wisdom was evil. Enlil tried to wipe out knowledge of the DNA coding Enki gave humans, and of what the Anunnaki used in order to have longevity (gold).

However, Enlil was not completely successful because most of Enki’s plan had worked. For centuries afterwards, humans attempted to duplicate the concoction of gold the gods used to maintain their youth and health, and those with the knowledge were able to manufacture substitutes for a while. But, much also had to do with the DNA content of the individual.



The more pure Anunnaki DNA, the better chance one had of having longevity, etc. Then, combine the DNA with spiritual awakening to the body, blood, and spirit with nutritional supplements, and each human will know who they are - gardeners, and caretakers of the Earth, not owners. Humans are here to maintain beauty, harmony and balance that was first given to us after the Earth was created. We are not to be interested only in ourselves.

Why did Adam eat from the Tree of Knowledge and not from the Tree of Life? Without getting into complex detail, Enki told me simply:

"With the Tree of Knowledge humans had the chance to figure out everything on their own in time, to be equal to the Anunnaki. Had they eaten only from the Tree of Life, they would live but not have been more the wiser."

The Garden of Eden, by the way, was a literal place, but also a genetic metaphor.

Enki knew had Adam (Adapa) eaten from the other tree, it would not ensure wisdom or spiritual evolution. Instead, it would more likely result in primitive human living for eons without evolution. The story of this translated from the ancient Babylonian texts is very interesting with Adapa’s confusion over whom to believe, which to eat. It resulted in him eating "the wrong" thing, but actually it was the right thing, in terms of DNA, which would eventually bring our spirituality back from whence it faltered, and remind people to tend to the Earth, which was not created by extraterrestrials, but by God.

The battle between the brothers continued into the time of the pyramid wars and Exodus. The staff with the caduceus was also one of Moses’ tools. The serpent, for the Hebrews represented salvation and wisdom. Moses’s copper serpent staff, often utilized by his brother, Aaron, was made famous for performing miracles. Another connection between the staff and the serpents occurred during the Exodus when the staff was seen to transform into snakes. Aaron was high priest and had been trained in magic.



He and Moses received instructions from a collective of that main Anunnaki family (who taught Moses the alphabet). Isn’t it interesting that during the Exodus, the name Jehovah, YHWH, took over and the name Adonai began to disappear? This was at the time when Enki departed the Earth and Marduk became the leader of Enki’s family. Enlil’s family was given the Sinai (taken away from Ninharsag) and Enlil’s son, Sin, was its new ruler. His symbol is the crescent moon (which became the symbol for Islam).

Luckily, the heritage of the caduceus lived on. In some versions the staff is capped with a solar disk or even a crescent moon. Nisaba, one of Enki’s daughters, also held a similar staff topped with an "ankh." For some, the staff symbolized Hermes/Mercury. Throughout time different civilizations in India, the Americas, Greece, Egypt, including the great mystery schools and secret societies have renamed and used it. In Christianity the archangel Michael was associated with this staff. The sirens became the staff for two serpents they held in their hands. This staff was considered to be so powerful it was able to raise up the dead.

The symbol of the caduceus was later transferred to one of Enki’s counterparts, Ningishzida (Thoth), the healing god, and then to others of his family because it was a code for the bloodline of Enki’s heritage. From this symbol of the serpent the power was transferred to the symbol of the dragon, who continued to hold the knowledge. The dragon could "divine." This is one reason why we say we and you are of "divine" heritage. You will see a version of the caduceus as the winged solar disk in Ancient Egypt, which incorporated the knowledge of one’s divinity and eternal soul, in the third eye chakra, along with the traditional knowledge of what it stood for.



Therefore, you will see this symbol above arches and entrances into temples and royal structures to remind those who enter who they really are. And this means not only the DNA connection to the Anunnaki, but the divine soul-being as coming from the Source, itself. The symbol of the winged Isis represents the original female mother goddess, Ninharsag, and blood connection in birthing humans who mated with "the gods," those who fly as a free spirit.

When you see the caduceus, know you are triggering your own genetic memory and seeing your heritage. Each one of you holds within you the DNA, in varying degrees, the wisdom from the Anunnaki and the Source. Since Enki and Ninhursag, there have been other off-planet beings who added in their own DNA to the human species.



So, you are all a mixture - and all one family from the One God. Within you is the consciousness with which you can liberate yourselves through SELF-knowledge and return to the garden.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v648/Swampdragon/c54a0b38.jpg

[Penguin]

Ok so my sort of random question for the day...

Are there other legends of a great flood that corospond to the time period of the noah story?

[swampdragon]

Ok so my sort of random question for the day...

Are there other legends of a great flood that corospond to the time period of the noah story?

The timeline is tough.
We don't even agree on a Biblical timeline.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKZhd3mJeBE


Main article: Noah

The similarities between the story of Noah's Ark, the Sumerian story of Ziusudra, and the Babylonian stories of Atrahasis and Utnapishtim are shown by corresponding lines in various versions:

"the storm had swept...for seven days and seven nights" — Ziusudra 203
"For seven days and seven nights came the storm" — Atrahasis III,iv, 24
"Six days and seven nights the wind and storm" — Gilgamesh XI, 127
"rain fell upon the earth forty days and forty nights" — Genesis 7:12

"He offered a sacrifice" — Atrahasis III,v, 31
"And offered a sacrifice" — Gilgamesh XI, 155
"offered burnt offerings on the altar" — Genesis 8:20
"built an altar and sacrificed to the gods" — Berossus.

"The gods smelled the savor" — Atrahasis III,v,34
"The gods smelled the sweet savor" — Gilgamesh XI, 160
"And the Lord smelled the sweet savor..." — Genesis 8:21

The Hebrew flood story of Genesis 6-9 dates to at least the 5th century BC. According to the documentary hypothesis, it is a composite of two literary sources J and P that were combined by a post-exilic editor, 539-400 BC. Hans Schmid believes both the J material and the P material were products of the Babylonian exile period (6th century BC) and were directly derived from Babylonian sources (see also Panbabylonism).[19]

[Penguin]

The timeline is tough.
We don't even agree on a Biblical timeline.

Main article: Noah

The similarities between the story of Noah's Ark, the Sumerian story of Ziusudra, and the Babylonian stories of Atrahasis and Utnapishtim are shown by corresponding lines in various versions:

"the storm had swept...for seven days and seven nights" — Ziusudra 203
"For seven days and seven nights came the storm" — Atrahasis III,iv, 24
"Six days and seven nights the wind and storm" — Gilgamesh XI, 127
"rain fell upon the earth forty days and forty nights" — Genesis 7:12

"He offered a sacrifice" — Atrahasis III,v, 31
"And offered a sacrifice" — Gilgamesh XI, 155
"offered burnt offerings on the altar" — Genesis 8:20
"built an altar and sacrificed to the gods" — Berossus.

"The gods smelled the savor" — Atrahasis III,v,34
"The gods smelled the sweet savor" — Gilgamesh XI, 160
"And the Lord smelled the sweet savor..." — Genesis 8:21

The Hebrew flood story of Genesis 6-9 dates to at least the 5th century BC. According to the documentary hypothesis, it is a composite of two literary sources J and P that were combined by a post-exilic editor, 539-400 BC. Hans Schmid believes both the J material and the P material were products of the Babylonian exile period (6th century BC) and were directly derived from Babylonian sources (see also Panbabylonism).[19]

More interisting stuff. Thanks a lot. One of these days I should get around to reading the bible. Perhaps it is more interisting than I thought.