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Wild Bill
12-16-2010, 08:13 PM
Just got a SAR 3 off gunbroker for $381.00. I did not think that my bid would win for that price. I normally like the 7.62 better but a 5.56 could be useful. Seems to be a good rifle. I really like the wood stock. The Sar 2 and 3's seem to have more attractive stock sets that the Sar 1's. Can't wait to take it to the range tomorrow. I have a few questions for anyone willing to point me in the right direction.

1. The bolt does not lock back. Is that normal? Can I adjust or replace any part to enable the bolt to lock back?

2. I would like to put a treaded front sight block or tread the barrel. Does anybody know where to purchase a 22mm fsb? Can I use a 24mm? If threading the barrel is the easier route, what size threading dye is needed? 14x1 or 1/2x28?

3. I have heard the trigger parts were not the best quality. Should I assume they will need to be replaced?

Thank you for the info!!!!!

btcave
12-16-2010, 09:05 PM
I've owned one since 2002.

-Bolt lock back is not in the design. Most tend to have the ability to lock back if you hold the trigger when you pull it back, but it is not a design feature. My Romanian PSL is the only AK variant that I've run across with a bolt lock back inherent in the design.

- My trigger was perfect, so I didn't need to change it out. I know SAR 1's often had a trigger slap that could be painful to the finger, requiring modification of the trigger or a replacement from an aftermarket manufacturer like www.redstararms.com. They make triggers compatible with the SAR-3 rifles also.

I can't answer the threading question for you. Someone will come along soon to answer it I'm sure.

Schuetzenman
12-16-2010, 09:08 PM
Just got a SAR 3 off gunbroker for $381.00. I did not think that my bid would win for that price. I normally like the 7.62 better but a 5.56 could be useful. Seems to be a good rifle. I really like the wood stock. The Sar 2 and 3's seem to have more attractive stock sets that the Sar 1's. Can't wait to take it to the range tomorrow. I have a few questions for anyone willing to point me in the right direction.

1. The bolt does not lock back. Is that normal? Can I adjust or replace any part to enable the bolt to lock back? No, the bolt does not lock back, no AK bolt locks back so I take it this is your first AK type weapon.

2. I would like to put a treaded front sight block or tread the barrel. Does anybody know where to purchase a 22mm fsb? Can I use a 24mm? If threading the barrel is the easier route, what size threading dye is needed? 14x1 or 1/2x28? If you were to thread the barrel 1/2x28 would probably work. Being a Romanian rifle the barrels are quite skinny. K-Var may be the best source for a front sight base with threads to use the AK74 brakes. They however are arrogant and I would almost rather eat crushed glass than order from them.

3. I have heard the trigger parts were not the best quality. Should I assume they will need to be replaced? I have a SAR-3 for a long time now. I have at least 500 rounds through it, haven't seen any wear in the trigger, hammer or disconnector. There are replacement parts but I take the attitude that if it doesn't break, don't fix it.

Thank you for the info!!!!!

I've owned and built a lot of AK type weapons. Had a SAR-1, 2 and 3. Had Bulgarian a SLR95 and a Hungarian SA-85M. Built Romanian, Hungarian AMD65, AMD63 and Polish under folder types. The SAR-3 is the only AK I still own as it's hands down the most accurate one. The best magazines for them are steel Weiger magazines that were made by the East Germans. Hard to find these days and up there in price. Next best is the Bulgarian waffle pattern polymer mags with steel feed lip inserts and steel lugs for locking into the receiver. Everything else is crap.

btcave
12-16-2010, 09:12 PM
I've owned and built a lot of AK type weapons. Had a SAR-1, 2 and 3. Had Bulgarian a SLR95 and a Hungarian SA-85M. Built Romanian, Hungarian AMD65, AMD63 and Polish under folder types. The SAR-3 is the only AK I still own as it's hands down the most accurate one. The best magazines for them are steel Weiger magazines that were made by the East Germans. Hard to find these days and up there in price. Next best is the Bulgarian waffle pattern polymer mags with steel feed lip inserts and steel lugs for locking into the receiver. Everything else is crap.

You only got 500 rounds through it? I think mine is up around 2500. Most in the first two years. Ah, when 5.56 was $95/1000 rnds out the door.

imanaknut
12-16-2010, 09:27 PM
I have an SAR-3 with original fire control group that has fired well over 7000 rounds. I have only had one issue with it, and that was ammo related. Wolf polymer is junk.

That said, I wouldn't expect to have to replace the fire control group until after firing it and seeing how it works. Two things to remember, SARs had two stage triggers. They have a distinct pull back to where you can feel the hammer is about to release. With practice I find them really nice shooters because of this. Please don't complain about long trigger pull.

The other, and more important thing is the SAR-3 hammer has a special profile that no other AK variant that I am aware of has. The bolt is shorter than the standard AK bolt, so the hammer has to travel further to hit it. If you replace the hammer, make sure you get an SAR-3 hammer, or reprofile the new one yourself to make sure it hits the back of the bolt squarely. You do not want to risk damaging that hard to find bolt.

Other things to be aware of with the SAR-3. They were designed to use the mag from the German STG-940 weapons system, commonly called Wiegers from the city Wiesa in Germany where they are made. (WIEsa GERmany) If you use the modified by Century AK-74 mags without further modifying them with proper followers, you will have feed issues. The AK-74 30 round mag that has had the feed lips opened up for the .223/5.56x45 round should not be loaded beyond 20 rounds without the modified follower or you can have feed issues.

The metal Wieger mags are easily identified as they are the only AK style mag that has two round pushbuttons through the floor plate to hold the mag together.

I don't know how familiar you are with AKs, so forgive me if I state something you already know.

AKs get their reliability in part due to really loose tolerances in their build. If you notice that the gas piston is loose on the bolt carrier, that is normal. The proper installation is to thread them into the carrier until snug, then back off 1/4 to 1/2 a turn, then pin in place. This little bit of looseness helps during recoil when the bolt comes back and the carrier lifts slightly in the front.

Unfortunately when Century replaced the evil imported parts with enough angelic US parts to get the imported part count down to the mandated 10 imported, they replaced the gas piston, but in many didn't install the new part properly. Some were welded in. If welded straight you won't have any problems, but if not, you could have feed issues.

If you look closely at the front sight base, you might be able to see where the idiot importer cut the threads off. With the SAR-3 and SAR-2, ATF determined that even during the clinton stupidity, having threads were legal on those two rifles because there were no 22mm flash hiders. Century did not have to remove them, but did. Replacements are available. I have restored more than a few myself, and it really makes a difference in felt recoil having the correct brake on the SAR-3.

Enough?

If you have any more questions, feel free to ask.

Now go out and enjoy that beauty!!!!

Oh, one other thing, and again forgive me, but this is me. Make sure you run a patch through the barrel before taking it out. There is nothing worse that buying something sight unseen and finding out that some kid used the barrel to hide the candy wrappers from their mom!!!!!!!!

Schuetzenman
12-16-2010, 10:17 PM
You only got 500 rounds through it? I think mine is up around 2500. Most in the first two years. Ah, when 5.56 was $95/1000 rnds out the door.

Yes as I like the way it works and didn't want to wear it out. Barrels don't last forever. I have had plans to get it cryo treated, but have not followed through yet. Cryo treatment can make a barrel last 2x as long. A .223 barrel should be good for around 8,000 to 10,000 rounds before it becomes a tomato stake. Now, the ammo is too damn expensive to shoot a lot of it. I reload, but components are way up too.

To Nut's point about the pistons being welded in. My SAR-3 had a crooked welded in piston. It caused the carrier to drag and skip over the mag and not pickup a round. The quick fix was to bend it straight, but eventually as it would heat up the piston would warp back and cause the weapon to missfeed ammo. I finally replaced it with a Tapco Stainless Steel piston and that fixed it, never a missfeed malfunction since then.

btcave
12-16-2010, 10:36 PM
Yes as I like the way it works and didn't want to wear it out. Barrels don't last forever.

Yeah. I lost the desire for mag dumps several years ago, but at the time it was my first semi-auto "assault rifle" so I abused it a bit. It took a few running jack rabbits over the years. I practically baby it now. It is every bit as accurate as my M4gery. I'll not be selling it.

Wild Bill- Hang on to that. You'll love it. They are gems.

imanaknut
12-16-2010, 11:03 PM
Most of my 7000 rounds were during the days of $100 or less per case. Have only run about near another 1000 rounds through since the great ammo debacle.


Amazing how much .22LR I have been using lately, but it just isn't the same.

Wild Bill
12-17-2010, 06:38 PM
Thanks for the great info. I was having a little buyers remorse and thinking that I should have ordered from Arsenal for a 5.56 ak type. However, if I am understanding right, the SAR rifles are amoung everyones favorites. I can tell you that my SAR 1 is an awesome rifle and shoots better than prebans that I have had in the past. I picked it up here a few years back from Warlord and my first three shots to zero the rifle were center bullseye.

So, back to the SAR 3.
The charging hangle is not supposed to lock back.

KVar is my best bet for a 22mm FSB.

Dont fix what is not broke with the trigger group.

Thanks again.

imanaknut
12-17-2010, 06:45 PM
I think you've got it!

Now all you need is ammo and time to have fun!

Please post a range report!

ENJOY!!!

Wild Bill
12-22-2010, 06:50 PM
Found a 22mm front sight block from www.dsarms.com. The price was reasonable and they shipped the next day after the order. I do recommend them if you are looking for a 22mm fsb.

Now, can anyone recommend a qualified gunshith with AK experience that can install the brake in Central Texas?

Does anyone know where to find an origional Romanian brake?

Any recommendations would be highly appreciated.

Schuetzenman
12-22-2010, 07:38 PM
Found a 22mm front sight block from www.dsarms.com. The price was reasonable and they shipped the next day after the order. I do recommend them if you are looking for a 22mm fsb.

Now, can anyone recommend a qualified gunshith with AK experience that can install the brake in Central Texas?

Does anyone know where to find an origional Romanian brake?

Any recommendations would be highly appreciated.

No recommendation on a gunsmith. Frankly most adult males should be able to do the replacement. The front sight tower that would have the threads for the brake are held on with two pins. In theory once you get the old one off you would simply need to line up the holes on the bottom of the sight with the existing grooves from the last pins, then drive in pins. On where to find the brake, same answer as the last time. How to get the old sight off, in as much as you are replacing it, use a dremel with cut off discs and simply slit the bottom of the old sight end to end. Then take a chisel and pop the slit to shear through the pins. You just need to avoid cutting 100% through the bottom of the old sight in order to not grind a slit in the barrel.

imanaknut
12-22-2010, 07:49 PM
About the only issues I had replacing the ones I did, the worst case on removing the old one was they were so tight that after removing the cross pins they wouldn't move after smacking them with a nice mallet. What ever you do, do not use a "dead-blow hammer" as they are only good for shaping paper.

What I wound up doing was using a cut-off wheel on a dremel and cut the sight off using very shallow cuts until I was able to break it with a chisel to avoid damage to the barrel.

The other issue was that the cross pin holes were not drilled on the new sights, and I had to use a high speed carbide bit to drill them out. Seems that they are made of really hard metal.

When knocking the cross pins out, have the end of the barrel on a block of wood on a very solid object, like a cement floor. I have found that even the slight shock absorbing of a work bench is enough to keep the pins from budging.

Use a punch holder (available at Sears) to hold the punch when driving out the cross pins. It not only saves hands and fingers, but because of that it allows you to hit the punch harder knowing there is no risk to your hands.

Other than that, it is a fairly straight forward operation.

Glad to pass along issues that I ran into to hopefully make things easier on you.