i seek sage advice about my bwk92

[stinker]

This might be a post better suited for the modification section but oh well.
The rifle is a chicom so it seems plausable for here.

Ever get that queasy gnawing feeling in your gut you're about to make a mistake?
Just for the sake of being thorough here's the only pic i have of it handy.
(i'm out on the road in an 18 wheeler atm)
http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/4335/020511114100.jpg
History of the rifle.
I picked it up in a pawn shop around 1995ish for (i think) $275 exactly as you see it now but with a smaller scope that was fubared.
I bought it to shoot, not have it exclusively decorate a closet.
It's absolutely completely dependable. I pull the trigger it goes bang without exception.
Because of the dependability firing i consider it my SHTF rifle.
I allready have at least a dozen norinco 5.56x45 metal 30 round mags for it and 2 norinco 10 rounders.
The stability of that scope mount is in question. It was on the rifle when i bought it.
It's perma bolted to the left side of the receiver with 4 screws through a internal/external block base. I think it might wiggling around under recoil but i'm not sure.
Never finished zeroing it in after i took the fubared scope off and then hit the road working right after.
Just never made the time or had enough money until now.


I just recently found out about the 922 compliance rules.
I had my dad snap that pic was elated when i saw the receiver was not slant cut and of course immediately went bats**t nuts buying parts.

The things i have so far...
ATI strikeforce kit with the aluminum upgrades
New receiver buffer(just in case)
New pistol grip screw(just in case)
Tapco G2 double hook group

Things i'm thinking about doing to it.
Swap out the front sight block so i can have threads again(not enough there to just thread it)
Swap out the gas block thingamajig so the bayo lug is restored.
With those two i can again put a cleaning rod back on it(impossible currently)
Yank that scope mount off and have a gunsmith plug the holes(maybe)
If either Krebs, TWS or someone gets around to making a quality quick release beryl rail that will work on a chinese rifle the maybe will become a definitely for yanking off that mount.
Hole plugging will most likely mean completely refinishing the receiver.

I also have an AR mag adapter allready on the way, which is the most important part of my concerns.
It means milling the receiver of a somewhat unusual rifle.

Since it's to be a SHTF rifle in 5.56 and it takes perhaps the hardest to find magazines i think i've ever seen i think it makes complete sense to make it able to use a magazine you could grab from any dead soldier or some misc butthole that does'nt know how to clean his jammed ar-15 every single day(no bias there, no way, no how :laugh:)

Bottom line...I want a 5.56 AK that can use ar15 mags.
I allways have since i first saw the adapters that are factory made for the galil, but a galil was allways way too expensive.

Am i being an idiot for planning to do all that to this particular rifle or should i keep it intact from any permanent changes?
Or should i just suck it up and shuck out the big bucks to buy a saiga 5.56 or an arsenal because i'd be stupid to grind on that rifle?

Opinions please.

[NAPOTS]

Being somewhat of a rarity, I'd put proper wood furniture back on that bad boy and leave it in "84-S" ish configuration.

There are plenty of other guns out there that take ar mags.

[imanaknut]

Welcome to the group !!! :welcome:

The 84S is one of my favorite AK variants, a very accurate, very reliable shooter. The BWK92 is nothing more than an 84S that got attacked by George Bush the First because it looked too evil for that bum.

The modifications you mention are worth it if you are worried about 922(r) (Title 27 CFR 478.39). It is too bad because the Norinco trigger group is arguably the best factory fire control group ever installed in a commercial AK variant.

Very few people were able to get their fingers around that Bush-hole stock as it came from the factory, so anything you do to get rid of it is a good thing.

You have a good number of Norinco mags, which as you know are getting crazy expensive. While the idea of using a mag from the good old M16 sounds nice, in reality is almost impossible in an AK without major modifications. A few years ago I tried to make an adapter that would allow use of an M16 mag in any .223 AK, using both the SAR-3 and 84S as a guide. Never could get it to work with the reliability of the mags that either variant used so I pretty much gave up.

As you state, you have at least a dozen 84S mags, so I wouldn't worry about ever needing more. Those should outlast any SHTF scenario that might crop up, and still allow you to use the common rounds found in current NATO weapons.

Oh, I believe that any "5.56 AK that can use ar15 mags" could be called a Sig 556 which has a similar operating mechanism and uses USGI mags.

[stinker]

Sooo....I went ahead and made the decision to make the mods to the rifle and can only say one thing about the progress so far.

MOTHER F-ING G-DAGNABBIT I HATE THIS DRAMA BS!
Somebody please just bust out a krink and finish me off... :hungio8:

Oh yeah...details.

I gave up on the possibility of a proper 84ish restoration. Chicom barrel parts are damn near impossible to find now without a donor rifle as far as i can tell.

I picked out a gunsmith to do the work plus a little extra stuff.
I'm betting he at least trolls here but i won't name him as i consider the dispute settled but not completely satisfied. The rifle should be instantly recognized because of that scope mount so you know who i am. You might want to keep reading and get an idea why i got so pissed at you and what this BS actually cost me. If you're reading this i would'nt advise responding if you want to remain anonymous as i WILL name you if you want a pissing match on here about this.

As i mentioned previously i drive an 18 wheeler so i basically live out on the road so even basic stuff like just zipping over to a gunshop to grab stuff, knowing if something i ordered shipped is at the house or even to check parts for measurments to see if something will fit is like pulling teeth that aren't there. It's simply impossible.

I spent a month putting everything together. Gathering parts and such. I called the gunsmith about two weeks before i went home to get the work done professionally since i lack the proper tools to do so myself and asked if it would be possible to arrange the work completed within three or four days since i only get to go home for five days. After i leave back to work i'm looking at a minimum of two months before i get to go home again. The person said sure..not a problem, we can work something out.

Basic list of work to be completed.
Mill out the receiver to accept a mag adapter.
Thread the barrel to accept ar15 flash supressor/compensator(ground but enough material for ar15 threads)
Swap out the chicom tang with a krebs rail compatible one.
Weld up/smooth out the four holes drilled in the receiver left over from that POS scope mount.
Refinish the entire rifle in flat black. Needed due to the receiver welding.

I figure (unless i'm delusional) someone that is very familliar with tearing down ak's and has the proper tools on hand could do all of the work except the surface prep/refinishing job in about three or four hours tops. Naturally the refinishing would take a bit longer but three or four days is more than enough.

My top condition of getting this work done was that it be finished BEFORE i go back out on the road. If that was not agreed to i would have just given the work to somebody that could meet that simple requirement.I stressed this point repeatedly on the phone and in person.

I got home late last monday, dropped the gun off tuesday along with a $200 deposit, waited wednesday, waited thursday,waited friday, called saturday and was informed that the person was busy with something else and did'nt know the exact status of my work but the info will be available in a little bit....ok...next call i get is from someone else informing me that my rifle was about six weeks from being worked on.

As i said exactly on the phone....EXCUSE ME?
Then the person on the phone decides to get indignant with me about the fact that i'm very much not happy(understatement of the year)

I am unwilling to leave the rifle in the hands of someone i just met while i'm halfway across the country in god knows what state for the next two months. Other than the glaring fact i was just blatently lied to it's a matter of principle and the avoidance of murphys law.

After a bit of drama and me being about ready to burst a blood vessel all day i went to the persons place and with an absolute minimal amount of conversation i get my rifle and my $200 back. That makes the matter settled as well as it can be.

Why not satisfied?
Because of what it cost me to go home and do this and how much of a PITA it was.

I had to rent a vehicle to get from our truck terminal and drive several hours
home because my dipwad dispatchers are too stupid to figure out how to get me there.

Cost of rental vehicle..$487

Because i was at home i'm not working i lost a weeks worth of income.
Cost...impossible to know exactly but somewhere in the ballpark of $800+ is a good reasonable guess.

I also have a nice shiny new eotech and 3x magnifier purchased on the way to the gunsmiths place, in anticipation of resolving the rail issue , sitting in a closet gathering dust now since i have no rifle to put it on due to the work not getting done.
Fun with $960 paperwieghts 101.

Oh yeah...and then theres the small matter of wasting 5 days of my life waiting on someone who had absolutely no intention of doing the one thing i wanted most.

The ONLY reason i was at home at that time was to get the rifle worked on.
Like i said on the phone. You just burned me bad.

And screwed up. I have plans on buying a saiga 12 after i'm done screwing around with this norinco and possibly a 308 too..Woulda needed more work done since i lack proper tools methinks. Then theres the small matter of me wanting a couple of pistols refinished to get rid of some wear marks sometime soon as well.

Not exactly enough to put your kids through college but a nice paycheck reguardless.

:big-fu:

:rant:
I just needed to vent.


Oh, I believe that any "5.56 AK that can use ar15 mags" could be called a Sig 556 which has a similar operating mechanism and uses USGI mags.
Why oh why did'nt i take the blue gun case....
I'm seriously considering ditching this whole project and following that little tidbit of wisdom now.

[Abel]

Mr. Stinker, no more has been commented on this subject so I wish to ask a question. If you are still dissapointed with ordeal with this rifle, are you willing to depart with a couple of the mags? Even one of the 30-rounders? I also have a BWK but only have 1 30-rounder for it. I wwould greatly appreciate any input back. Thank you.

[stinker]

Actually i've made considerable progress on it and a couple changes from the original plan. I found a competent gunsmith to do the machine work and i got the magwell adapter installed proper like, threaded the barrel and got the holes from that damn scope mount filled and smoothed. At this point i'm pretty much done with it except refinishing because of the welding of the holes. I'm having a little trouble locating someone competent that does cerakote in west houston so i can have my dad run it over there to get it done.

I was waiting to get that done before i posted a pic that'll probably give the woodstock purists a heart attack :)

Wolrking on a rifle from a couple thousand miles away on the road is just a wee bit difficult and takes an ungodly amount of time and shipping fees. It would be done allready if not for that.

Those mags pop up on gunbroker quite often too btw since you're looking for some. I think i read the bulgarian 5.56 mags are usable too but i'm not sure as i never tried one. You could also do the magwell adapter if you're willing to slightly widen part of the magazine port. That lets you use ar15 mags which are basically disposable they're so common and inexpensive. The original mags still work exactly the same after the modification too. http://magnoliastatearmory.com/products-page/ak-47-parts/

I decided the mod was worth it since the dipwad that owned the rifle before me drilled it for that weaver mount and allready destroyed any pristine collectors value that was to be had by keeping it unmodified.

[recon]

Yep on the bulgarian mags. They will work in the 84s type 5.56 AK's.