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Thread: 12GA FH Shotgun/Rifles-8ga-4ga-585HE-700HE-Etc-

  1. #161
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    Guy sent thick sided 375 case, next size base diameter up from Nyati.He said,
    'Yes I ran them in a ___________ rifle built by ____, the best I
    could get was 44000 psi, any more and they were stuck''

    Big bore guys. other forums over the years related that trex/african case in 585
    size, thick sided cases, stuck when they loaded them over 45k psi.

    Another just sent us, thick sided 375, long case, same base OD as our 585 HE,
    416 HE, 375 HE, and Mitch's 375 Lethal, and the thick ones stuck over 45k psi.

    Now you can fill those cases up, with ultra slow enough powder so they won't
    stick, but powder is too slow for max speed. Might get a little more
    speed, with thick sides case, but case got to be 4- 4.5 inches long..

    . Anyone needing a sectioned case of the ones I made the first of my 585s from,
    contact me, if they want to get a general idea of what case side thickness should
    be, in Gibbs size cases on up to about trex and 375 VM size case diameter.

    Here is pic of our 585 based case next to brand X and thick ones, both have
    same sharp, thinner, corner, where transition from heavy angled corner, to the
    side, the carbide draw rod could easily be reshaped with diamond wheel,
    just by grinding off sharp transition corner. Then sides would be perfect.., .




    Here is picture of 416 HE in a Choate target/varmint stock guy is doing,
    using long action BSA U9 action.Setting in stock ready to do bedding..Ed


  2. #162
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    Here is picture of thick 375 case sent to me, with thick sided trex case, and our HE case,
    The thick 375 case is .050" bigger OD base, but inside is no bigger than HE cases..
    These thick sided 375s stuck for the guy using them, when loaded over 44,000 psi....



    Got guys asking and doing it, to do 416 HSM case for BMG actions, so leaving rim same,
    as the original bmg rim, so will neck them, fire form to the longer shoulder, like the others.
    Base a little bigger, Shoulder same diameter, same 30 degree slant, neck will be same..

    Inside of case still has close to same shape, volumne within 3 % as ones we slimmed down more.
    Some want to use bmg actions and can't wait for intermediate actions, or already have bmg action.
    And they are really getting interested in the complete line of 416 CEB bullets now being done
    clear up to 550 gr...

    So there will be 3 versions, one for actions .750" bolt, one for .800-.850" bolt,
    And one for bigger bmg bolts. The ones for BMG called 416 HSM2 ..

    Here is 416 HSM guy working in a Montana PH, in a heavy thumbhole target stock. Ed



  3. #163
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    I hope it weighs 10+
    While no one ever listens to me,
    I am constantly being told to be quiet.

    In a world of snowflakes,
    be the heat..

  4. #164
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    About 30 without tripod..

    Here is sectioned 585 HE case in the middle, we first made from

    another case, years ago before we had factory run of brass and

    it had perfect thickness on the sides and inside corrner.

    We could fire them many times without sides thinning..

    First case is factory run of our 585 HE, 3rd is case that is too

    thick of sides and sticks at high pressures..



    Pic of our factory run cases necked down to 375 and fired 4 times

    at high pressure on the right, with unfired case on the left.

    Our case is not perfect but does work...Ed


  5. #165
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    About 416 cal bullets............

    The heaviest 550 gr for Extreme ELR probably be best 8 to 1 twist , in 416 caliber bullet,
    and 520 gr 9.5 to 1, and 470gr 10 to one, Some barrels I picked up are 10 to 1.......

    Now a novel idea is to lighten rear of bullet with small shallow hole drilled in base, might do better
    long range.which would allow 10 to one barrel stabilize the heavier 550 gr bullets for ELR.
    Making bullet nose heavier makes it more stable in flight, needing less spin,
    like our hollow base 585 cal minie bullets only need 48 to 1 twist, or less
    while out regular 585 bullets need about 24 to 1 to stabilise them..............

    The winner of the King Of 2 Mile shoot last week was using 416 Barrett with a 1 to 10
    twist, with a 500 gr CEB Lazer bullet, ...Robert Brantley, with Manners Stocks....

    Paul Philips was third with a 416...

    GOOD NEWS-- There is now an importer and seller of our 585 HE brass getting set up here,
    in US, hopefully will be in stock, few weeks........ http://bertrambrass.com .. .. Caleb Hallet..

    Have got another intermediate size action besides the Montana PH our guys working on,
    to do speed testingwith. It is big long REM style action that can take our 416 HSM, ED

  6. #166
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    Experimental intermediate size action with the Montana PH, for comparison.

    It is an experimental action for our 416 HSM, to do our speed testing with

    and get a better action than Cheytac size actions, for bigger case ELR use,

    without going all way up to more expensive, huge actions.

    It is big long round style action that can take our 416 HSM, almost

    1.6" diameter action and .800" bolt, with locking lugs nearly as big as most

    BMG actions.... ED



  7. #167
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    Here is picture of the bolt from the experimental action,

    with our 416 HSM case in it. Note the amount of the

    base size of locking lugs, the amount of area on the bolt..





    Here is link to guy doing special 585 HE in the EU,

    Good pictures............www.585he.cz

    We tested intermediate action with a 700HE barrel we had here.

    Just temporary to test strength. 1000 gr over 3100..

    Action worked fine.. Ed.

  8. #168
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    Here is video of early water barrel test of the

    12ga From Hell, from years ago.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c48zTpsgbuk


    Here is picture from that video..





    Here is the intermediate size action for 416 HSM with test barrel, .Ed


  9. #169
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    In 416 HSM got a 415 gr long target bullet 3800,

    with plain barrel, no brake, on intermediate action,

    Now my 416 HE gets same 415gr bullet to 3300.Ed

  10. #170
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    Here is picture of our 416HSM cases with screw in shellholders,

    for Ammomaster, etc, and slip in shellholders for regular presses

    Also have some for big LEE Classic and Smart Reloader presses..

    A 378 WEA MAG in picture for comparison...


    Second is stacks of 416 HSM, about a third fireformed

    and the rest to be fireformed... So far total about 1700, Ed








  11. #171
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    Bob Snapp, 90, the great Gun Craftsman, of

    Clare, Michigan, passed away Jan 28th....

    He was an esteemed member of the

    American Custom Gunmakers Guild,

    Being its president in 1992..He liked

    working with Martini Cadet singleshot rifles

    .Worked with guys testing armor long time ago.

    Maybe the 1st to do 20mm necked down to 50cal

    We lost a great friend,,,Ed

  12. #172
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    .....


    It is possible rig up holders for many types setups.,

    About shellholder supply for big cases,

    RCBS and others make slip in holders for shotgun cases

    that can work or reworked for big rimmed rifle cases...

    Here are various sizes.......

    16ga-- .810" rim,........ 20ga-- .760" rim,....

    24ga-- .725" rim,....... 28ga .680" rim....

    Ch4d and Buffalo Arms also have these larger shellholders...


    We fireform the 416 HSM with 65 gr of medium speed

    surplus powder, with rest of case filled with farina

    and grits mix, with a play dough plug in the neck.

    It is loud, so we shoot it into big container through a barrel size

    size hole, so the sound is muffled, so it doesn't deafen us..


    It is great getting more companies making 416 caliber bullets,

    long target and bore rider bullets. Ed..



    ....

  13. #173
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    Wonder if a PTRD with 5 ft long barrel is stable enough

    for ELR , rebarrel to 416 and use our 416 HSM, 500 gr bullet ....

    .Here is up north guy using 585 HE in a PTRD with inserts,

    Light load.....Inserts are in the shape of the 14.5mm case....


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jyab...ature=youtu.be


    HERE ia video, 585 Hubel Express and water jugs - slow motion

    750 gr with 155gr RE17, just a moderate load.....Ed


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXAo1mJqw8Y

  14. #174
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    20mm Vulcan is a big case that works ok, without having

    the sides made too thick...They have thinner sides

    than smaller cases guys are getting that have the sides

    made too thick and won't extract easy or work with high pressures.


    Here Barnard P Cheytac bolt that would do for our 416 HSM..Ed......


  15. #175
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    Got guys doing various 416 HEs..

    One just built a 416 HE, just been testing it a few days..

    And using 168gr of HBMG 475 gr CEB, tested it, in good

    conditions, 2 shots at 1800 yards and was within

    a 1/4 of minute accuracy...A few shots at shorter ranges

    had same accuracy. Ed..

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