I am a good boss

[Kadmos]

And I just want to add that as long as the form is filled out and Cabelas gets his ID information and he walks out with the gun - then the ATF would have no reason to even think this was "off". The ledger has nothing about who paid for the gun.

No offense, I'm really not saying this to be a dick, but if you are for some reason hoping I'll say it's ok, that isn't going to happen.

I think it could be easily seen as a straw purchase. I've been to dealers who I assure you would not let that situation happen. I'm sure there are others who would probably make the sale.

Is it legal? The best answer I have is I do not think it is totally legal, at the very least when he fills out the form he will be saying something that is technically not true...He cannot truthfully say "Yes I am the person buying this gun"

Maybe I'm being overly cautious, but I honestly do not think this is totally legal, and because of this I'm going to say right now that I don't think you should do this without the advice of a lawyer knowledgeable in your state. I'm happy to debate the topic more if you wish, but at no point in this conversation will I advise you to take any further action without a lawyer.

Have a nice day!

[Goodman]

So have a gift certificate made out for the purchase price, hand it to him in the parking lot and say " go buy a Savage model xxxx", merry Christmas! That should put everyone at ease.

Whatcha think Kadmos?

[El Duce]

So have a gift certificate made out for the purchase price, hand it to him in the parking lot and say " go buy a Savage model xxxx", merry Christmas! That should put everyone at ease.

Whatcha think Kadmos?

I was about to say the same thing. Great gift Osok!

[bigj480]

Nothing illegal about paying for the gun as a gift. The guy receiving the gift would be buying the gun, just not paying for it. He's using the money gifted to him for the purchase and it is in his name. Where there is a problem is when one person fills out the forms so that another person doesn't have to. I bet Cabellas has done this a time or two and all will go well.

[O.S.O.K.]

I will just ask them the best way to handle it when I get there. I really don't think it'll be a problem. And Kadmos, I wasn't trying to get you to a agree. I was just trying to make you understand that it's not a problem as you seem very worried about it.

And thanks guys - I feel really great about doing this for Mike (that's his name). He's a real loyal guy that works hard and needs no pushing to get things done. The kind of guy I really like working with. He deserves this.

I've tried to get the company to include a bonus program for him but they won't go for it... so, I'm giving him some of mine basically.

[Kadmos]

I'm pretty sure Cabelas will likely be able to keep everyone on the right side of the law, I just don't want to see it bite you on the ass for trying to do something really awesome with no bad intent.

These laws have gotten ridiculous. The 4473 actually says in the instructions, as an example, that you should pay for the gun, fill out the form and then it is your gun to give as a gift.

To me this seems way worse, and it contradicts the whole different state issue, what if god forbid it turns out he's on the run as a serial killer, it would have been better for him to fill out the form in the first place like you want!

It's funny because I've sold, bought and traded at gunshows several guns using the "loophole", and never asked or got asked more than are you a resident and are you a felon, cash gets passed and I think nothing of it.

And of course I've done the 4473's several times, answered honestly, and didn't think much of that either. But with these laws and how I got treated trying to just buy my own wife a gun, having anyone else do anything with that paperwork kinda freaks me out.

[O.S.O.K.]

I totally agree that the ATF sucks bad and should be shut down. At least the F part. They are a plague on our society.

There is no reason that we should have to even worry about this kind of situation.

[Kadmos]

There is no reason that we should have to even worry about this kind of situation.

Now that is the truth!

Gun laws in the US have become in my opinion, the most ridiculous laws, based the vast bulk of the time, on absolutely nothing realistic.

Another handle makes a gun "illegal", a short barrel makes a rifle illegal, but the same caliber pistol with even shorter barrel is fine, one too many foriegn parts and you have to worry about a prison sentance! I put "St. Louis" an the form and a guy has me scratch it out and write "Saint Louis", makes me wonder if soon it will have to be all typed, then signed by two witnesses and a notary (not that I want to give them any ideas!)

[gpwasr10]

I called the Cabelas and explained to the gunshop rep what I wanted to do - he said "no problem". I will of course explain again when I get there and make sure they see my carry permit and understand that I can purchase my own gun if I want.

I don't think this is going to be a problem.

I think you are being paranoid Kadmos.

Sure, the code is written poorly but what's new with uncle batfuck?

If they "look into this afterwards" they will find that my salesman has the gun - he is the one that filled out the form - there is no basis for any charges. If he sells it or it's stolen, still no problem for me or him.

Now if he doesn't have it and they come calling on me and I do, then there would be trouble.

I've had guns purchased for me as a gift. Should be no diffrent then if a father bought a gun for his son, the relationship may be diffrent, but the intent is the same.

[O.S.O.K.]

OK - got it done today! All went fine. They actually told me to buy the gun and just give it to him ( total straw buyer ) I asked if they could just hold the gun and I would buy him a gift card and then he could use that to buy the gun and do the paperwork. That's what we did.

I did not buy him the Savage Axis - they had a really nice slightly used Marlin XL7 in 30-06 with laminate stock and nice scope rail mounted - with the box too, and I decided to get him that - was more $$, but it was just too nice to pass up. I got a Redfield 3x9 scope and some Leupold Rifleman rings to go with - he's already mounted the scope:



He took this with his phone at home and sent it with a note saying how much he appreciated it and that "its the nicest gift I've gotten in a long time".



Guys, this felt really good. He did get a little teary when he realized I wasn't pulling his leg He said "Your the best boss ever!" after I took him and showed him the rifle.

We were back in the "gun library" where they'd put it aside for me in their office.

Very cool all the way around and I'm glad I did it.

Merry Christmas

[N/A]

Ok, good job. Now you know you got to get him lined out to go zero that scope don't you....


BTW, buying a gun and gifting it to someone who is perfectly legit to own a gun is not a strawman purchase.

[old Grump]

Ok, good job. Now you know you got to get him lined out to go zero that scope don't you....

Why do you ask, do you need him to help you set up one of your guns?

[btcave]

OSOK, great thread. Good job! That is the Christmas spirit of giving my friend. Very inspiring. Thank you.

[JTHunter]

It's a shame there aren't more managers/bosses out there like O.S.O.K. When they go the extra mile like this, it adds to the employee's confidence and morale in these trying times.
Nice going O.S.O.K.! That's a sweet looking set-up! Now this guy can bag everything from pronghorn to elk with one gun.

[N/A]

Why do you ask, do you need him to help you set up one of your guns?

No.

[O.S.O.K.]

Thanks guys. N/A - yes, I told him how to pull the bolt and bench the gun - looking down the bore at a target - 50 yards and aligning the scope's reticule with that - and then shoot - should be on the paper. I told him to take the afternoon and go to the range I'm looking forward to talking to him to see how it went.

Must have been good karma as our numbers really took off this week - a promotion that I ran on our boil spices took hold and boosted our numbers - looks like we will make the year And I had my review today with the boss and the owners - went really well. He was super complimentary and we had a really good discussion of what happened this past year and what we're planing for 2012.

All good

[old Grump]

No.

Well then do you want me or any of the other riflemen on board to help you? Just say so and we will be happy to give you all the assistance you need.

[N/A]

No, Mr smartass, you can help yourself , but not me.

[old Grump]

No, Mr smartass, you can help yourself , but not me.

Well if you change your mind you know how to get hold of us.

[N/A]

Well if you change your mind you know how to get hold of us.

I don't know what your problem is dipstick, but you ain't got the brains, experience or gumption to teach me anything. You, on the other hand ought to learn some manners.