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Thread: Now This is an Interesting Chart (U.S. Federal Revenues)

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    Registered User LAGC's Avatar

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    Post Now This is an Interesting Chart (U.S. Federal Revenues)



    Lots of data here: http://www.usgovernmentrevenue.com/downchart_gr.php

    If these projections are true, in theory, if we just froze Federal spending at today's levels, we could balance the Federal budget in 5 years without raising taxes, and start paying down the debt.

    I was really surprised to see that during some of those middle Bush years, even with the Bush tax cuts, revenues increased considerably after initially falling in 2001-2003. The substitute host on Mark Levin's radio show made that statement last night and I didn't believe him at the time. Of course, under Bush, spending really took off between the wars and "homeland security", so what gains we made in revenue was dwarfed by all the bloated government largess.

    Of course, if the warmongering neo-conservatives take over and invade Iran all bets are off...
    "That tyranny has all the vices both of democracy and oligarchy is evident. As of oligarchy so of tyranny, the end is wealth; (for by wealth only can the tyrant maintain either his guard or his luxury). Both mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms." -- Aristotle, Book V, 350 B.C.E

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    What is a neo-conservative?
    While no one ever listens to me,
    I am constantly being told to be quiet.

    In a world of snowflakes,
    be the heat..

  3. #3
    Registered User LAGC's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by l921428x View Post
    What is a neo-conservative?
    Big government conservatives who advocate increasing government spending on military and other programs, like Bush and Newt Gingrich.

    And advocating interventionism in foreign affairs, "spreading democracy" by the sword, as it were...
    Last edited by LAGC; 12-29-2011 at 03:17 AM.
    "That tyranny has all the vices both of democracy and oligarchy is evident. As of oligarchy so of tyranny, the end is wealth; (for by wealth only can the tyrant maintain either his guard or his luxury). Both mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms." -- Aristotle, Book V, 350 B.C.E

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    So is the Pres a neo-marxist or the old style. Seems to me the Democrat Presidents have involved us in nation building more than the Repubs.
    WW1, WW2 Korea Vietnam?
    While no one ever listens to me,
    I am constantly being told to be quiet.

    In a world of snowflakes,
    be the heat..

  5. #5
    Senior Member mriddick's Avatar

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    If the chart is true
    Doubtful don't you think... The reality numbers drop 15% a year for 3 years in a row then as soon as it goes to estimation the numbers jump up 20% and climbs 10%/yr from their. My guess is the estimation numbers are very optimistic.

    in theory, if we just froze Federal spending at today's levels, we could balance the Federal budget in 5 years without raising taxes
    Social security and medicare keep climbing every year due to more people retiring then leaving the system. Unless you wanted to deny or cut benefits so today's' spending fit's tomorrow's retirees there can be no "freeze" that is workable.

    This is more of the same, pad the numbers so the future looks bright enough that we don't have to fully fund programs allowing the shortfall to be the next generations problem. It is going off the estimations that got us into this mess in the first place and a practice that needs to stop IMO.

  6. #6
    Team GunsNet Silver 12/2012 Warthogg's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by l921428x View Post
    What is a neo-conservative?

    Former left wingers, mainly Jews and view US foreign policy based on any affect on Israel. Even the casual reader will remember Neo-cons were the prime movers on the Iraq invasion.

    Here is a better discussion:

    As neo-con godfather, Irving Kristol once remarked, a neo-conservative is a "liberal who was mugged by reality". True to that description, neo-conservatives generally originated on the left side of the political spectrum and some times from the far left. Many neo-cons, such as Kristol himself, have Trotskyite roots that are still reflected in their polemical and organizational skills and ideological zeal.

    Although a number of prominent Catholics are neo-conservatives, the movement remains predominantly Jewish, and the monthly journal that really defined neo-conservatism over the past 35 years, Commentary, is published by the American Jewish Committee. At the same time, however, neo-conservative attitudes have reflected a minority position within the US Jewish community as most Jews remain distinctly liberal in their political and foreign policy views.

    Neo-conservative foreign policy positions, which have their origin in opposition to the "new left" of the 1960s, fears over a return to US isolationism during the Vietnam War and the progressive international isolation of Israel in the wake of wars with its Arab neighbors in 1967 and 1973,

    have been tactically very flexible over the past 35 years, but their key principles have remained the same.
    They begin with the basic foreign policy realism found in the pessimistic views of human nature and international diplomacy of the English political philosopher, Thomas Hobbes, that neo-cons share with most US practitioners: that "the condition of man [in a state of nature] ... is a condition of war of everyone against everyone." Or, as Machiavelli, another favorite thinker of the neo-cons, wrote, "Men are more ready for evil than for good."



    http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/EH13Aa01.html
    Last edited by Warthogg; 12-29-2011 at 12:36 PM.

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    Team GunsNet Silver 12/2012 Warthogg's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by l921428x View Post
    So is the Pres a neo-marxist or the old style. Seems to me the Democrat Presidents have involved us in nation building more than the Repubs.
    WW1, WW2 Korea Vietnam?
    A socialist I believe.

    Michelle may very well believe herself to be a Communist but I doubt she has the intelligence to really understand communism.


    Wart

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    Administrator imanaknut's Avatar

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    It seems that short of a revolution, and by that it doesn't have to be gunfire, just new thinking, our government could never just keep spending at current levels. They are out of control like a drunk who doesn't feel the amount of alcohol he has consumed, and continues drinking until death by alcohol poisoning.

    Same with our government, unless something radical happens, they are going to continue to spend until there is nothing left of this great country but a burning pile of former cities inhabited by those who still believes the government and society owe them everything.

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    Moderator & Team Gunsnet Platinum 07/2011 O.S.O.K.'s Avatar

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    If we don't boot obummer and gain control of the senate, there's little chance of any real "stop spending" activity. Further, I will say that if we don't elect a true reformer who, like RP will cut spending immediately by 1 Trillion and use that as a start, we will be fucked.

    We are running out of time and obummer is using his for-sure last year to cause as much new spending as he possibly can. The only thing slowing him down right now is the house.

    Having said all of that, if the dominoes begin to fall in this next year this is all academic...
    ~Nemo me impune lacessit~




  10. #10
    Senior Member Infidelski's Avatar

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    Good grief! With the $1.2T debt ceiling increase sneaking through congress right now (whilst on vacation) I'd say anything is possible. The congress is derelict in their duties.

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    Senior Member PROBASCO's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by LAGC View Post



    Lots of data here: http://www.usgovernmentrevenue.com/downchart_gr.php

    If these projections are true, in theory, if we just froze Federal spending at today's levels, we could balance the Federal budget in 5 years without raising taxes, and start paying down the debt.

    I was really surprised to see that during some of those middle Bush years, even with the Bush tax cuts, revenues increased considerably after initially falling in 2001-2003. The substitute host on Mark Levin's radio show made that statement last night and I didn't believe him at the time. Of course, under Bush, spending really took off between the wars and "homeland security", so what gains we made in revenue was dwarfed by all the bloated government largess.

    Of course, if the warmongering neo-conservatives take over and invade Iran all bets are off...
    "neo conservatives" talking points for progressives,
    ok, i will bite, if these are the revenues, where are the expenditures? you just cant look at accounts receivable and not accounts payable..that is if you want to predict anything.
    I prefer this data http://www.usdebtclock.org/

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    Senior Member PROBASCO's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Infidelski View Post
    Good grief! With the $1.2T debt ceiling increase sneaking through congress right now (whilst on vacation) I'd say anything is possible. The congress is derelict in their duties.

    what about the senate, 3 years and no budget passed....

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    Senior Member PROBASCO's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Warthogg View Post
    A socialist I believe.

    Michelle may very well believe herself to be a Communist but I doubt she has the intelligence to really understand communism.


    Wart
    i would say a marxist myself

  14. #14
    Senior Member Infidelski's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by PROBASCO View Post
    what about the senate, 3 years and no budget passed....
    Exactly... Congress Senate Hang'em All

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    Guns Network Contributor 04/2013 El Laton Caliente's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by LAGC View Post


    Lots of data here: http://www.usgovernmentrevenue.com/downchart_gr.php


    If these projections are true, in theory, if we just froze Federal spending at today's levels, we could balance the Federal budget in 5 years without raising taxes, and start paying down the debt.

    I was really surprised to see that during some of those middle Bush years, even with the Bush tax cuts, revenues increased considerably after initially falling in 2001-2003. The substitute host on Mark Levin's radio show made that statement last night and I didn't believe him at the time. Of course, under Bush, spending really took off between the wars and "homeland security", so what gains we made in revenue was dwarfed by all the bloated government largess.

    Of course, if the warmongering neo-conservatives take over and invade Iran all bets are off...
    Not even Reagan's economy turned around that much and it was the best growth period the USA has known in a century, may be ever...

    To have that revenue increase you would have to have the private sector's gross product damn near double, that ain't happening under the weight of obama care and increased regulation this admin is doing.

  16. #16
    Senior Member Justin's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by LAGC View Post
    Big government conservatives who advocate increasing government spending on military and other programs, like Bush and Newt Gingrich.

    And advocating interventionism in foreign affairs, "spreading democracy" by the sword, as it were...
    Didn't Obama "spread democracy by the sword," in Libya?

  17. #17
    Team GunsNet Bronze 07/2011 T2K's Avatar

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    I think this chart just confirms that we don't have a revenue (income) problem, we have a spending (deficit) problem.

    It's going to take something radical to fix our problems. Business as usual will result in the interest payments on our debt overwhelming us.

  18. #18
    Senior Member mriddick's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by T2K View Post
    I think this chart just confirms that we don't have a revenue (income) problem, we have a spending (deficit) problem.

    It's going to take something radical to fix our problems. Business as usual will result in the interest payments on our debt overwhelming us.
    I take it you missed the whole part about the "revenue part" being made up? Sadly we still have either and/or both (depending on how you want to address it) a spending and a revenue problem regardless of whatever rosy economic prediction is dreamed up by the admin...

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    Team GunsNet Bronze 07/2011 T2K's Avatar

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    Mr R - I was not referring to the future predictions. Such projections are silly and not even worth discussing. US Gov't revenues are MORE than enough for the US Gov't to do what it needs to do. But the US Gov't does a lot more than it should be.

  20. #20
    Senior Member chiak47's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by LAGC View Post
    so what gains we made in revenue was dwarfed by all the bloated government largess.
    Wait wut?
    I thought you lefties liked big beautiful .gov..
    FBHO

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