ALABAMA BLOCKS OBAMA FROM REGISTERING FOR THE PRIMARY PENDING VALIDATION ELIGIBILITY!

[LAGC]

I'm sorry, but this just makes the right look like a bunch of half wits. We pushed this before, and Obama held out for months, getting us all stirred up into a frenzy... only to have him release the Cert and make us all look like inbred retards. If we can FOCUS on the issues (i.e. Why Obama sucks; a seemingly easy task) there will be no need to worry. Also, his mother was an American citizen... doesn't matter if he was born on the fucking moon... the guy is a Citizen (Not a very good one) but according to the letter of the law, he is.

Yep, Birthers are total idiots. I have no doubt that the Obama Administration purposefully let out that fake long-form certificate so that the idiot Birthers would take the bait and focus on that instead of any real substantive issues. The short-form certificate (and the fact that HIS FUCKING BIRTH WAS PUBLISHED IN THE HONOLULU PRESS) should have settled all discussion, but morons want to keep grasping at straws trying to take down a sitting President over a silly issue.

Nothing turns off independent voters more than these shrill cries over his citizenship. If that's Obama opponents' biggest complaint, not his policies but his already well-settled fact of Hawaiian birth, they got nothing. He will be easily re-elected.

(And as if Alabama would ever vote for him regardless... )

[O.S.O.K.]

LAGC, calling somebody else an idiot. Now that's precious.

I can call up the local rag and have an announcement published - means nothing. Certainly not proof of anything.

And you fail to explain how/why obummer got a grant as a resident alien? That fact is documented now. Barry Sotero was born in Kenya.

[LAGC]

Did Obama's operatives "hack" the library microfiche as well?

Or maybe Obama's parents KNEW he was going to be president one day, so they submitted a fake entry to the newspaper?



Sorry, but Birthers really are idiots.

Obama's a citizen. It's settled law. There's no doubt about it.

Anyone who thinks otherwise really is a fool, including that dumb-fuck judge in Alabama.

[O.S.O.K.]

Aparently, you enjoy living in your own little fantasy world - OK.

And I'm copying this to the judge... just fyi.

[El Laton Caliente]

I'm sorry, but this just makes the right look like a bunch of half wits. We pushed this before, and Obama held out for months, getting us all stirred up into a frenzy... only to have him release the Cert and make us all look like inbred retards. If we can FOCUS on the issues (i.e. Why Obama sucks; a seemingly easy task) there will be no need to worry. Also, his mother was an American citizen... doesn't matter if he was born on the fucking moon... the guy is a Citizen (Not a very good one) but according to the letter of the law, he is.

Also, McCain was born in the Canal Zone IIRC, so it's not like he was born here either.

By legal definition from common law and the SCOTUS a Natural-Born Citizen and just a Citizen have different meaning. To be a Natural Born Citizen, both parents have to be US Citizens at the time of birth.

BTW, it looks like Romney may have the same problem. His father was a resedent of Mexico, but I'm not sure wheither he was Naturalized before Mitten's Birth... This may be the reason the Washington Repub's haven't pushed the issue.

[El Laton Caliente]

Yep, Birthers are total idiots. I have no doubt that the Obama Administration purposefully let out that fake long-form certificate so that the idiot Birthers would take the bait and focus on that instead of any real substantive issues. The short-form certificate (and the fact that HIS FUCKING BIRTH WAS PUBLISHED IN THE HONOLULU PRESS) should have settled all discussion, but morons want to keep grasping at straws trying to take down a sitting President over a silly issue.

Nothing turns off independent voters more than these shrill cries over his citizenship. If that's Obama opponents' biggest complaint, not his policies but his already well-settled fact of Hawaiian birth, they got nothing. He will be easily re-elected.

(And as if Alabama would ever vote for him regardless... )

Go back and READ what I posted. This has nothing AT ALL to do with where he was born, just that his father was not a US Citizen.

[El Laton Caliente]

God Bless Alabama!!!!

The case was in Georgia...

[Warthogg]

The case was in Georgia...

Second case in Alabama.


Wart

[Warthogg]

BTW, it looks like Romney may have the same problem. His father was a resedent of Mexico, but I'm not sure wheither he was Naturalized before Mitten's Birth... This may be the reason the Washington Repub's haven't pushed the issue.

Yup.

Utah wanted to become a state and some Mormons wanted to have/keep several wives. Those moved to Mexico - Mitten's clan - or to Canada.


Wart

[El Laton Caliente]

Second case in Alabama.


Wart

Haven't seen that one yet... I thought I was up on this...

[Kadmos]

Haven't seen that one yet... I thought I was up on this...

Psst. Check the title on this thread.

[gpwasr10]

By legal definition from common law and the SCOTUS a Natural-Born Citizen and just a Citizen have different meaning. To be a Natural Born Citizen, both parents have to be US Citizens at the time of birth.

BTW, it looks like Romney may have the same problem. His father was a resedent of Mexico, but I'm not sure wheither he was Naturalized before Mitten's Birth... This may be the reason the Washington Repub's haven't pushed the issue.

Ahhh... so if he wasn't born here in one of the States proper... The while he would be a citizen... he would not be "Natural Born"...

However...
"The Constitution does not define the phrase natural-born citizen, and various opinions have been offered over time regarding its precise meaning. The Congressional Research Service has stated that the weight of scholarly legal and historical opinion indicates that the term means one who is entitled under the Constitution or laws of the United States to U.S. citizenship "at birth" or "by birth," including any child born "in" the United States (other than to foreign diplomats serving their country), the children of United States citizens born abroad, and those born abroad of one citizen parent who has met U.S. residency requirements."
-Congressional Research Service. Nov. 14, 2011.

So as long as his mother was a citizen... then he is legit.

[Warthogg]

Ahhh... so if he wasn't born here in one of the States proper... The while he would be a citizen... he would not be "Natural Born"...

I think Barry's possible problem has to do with his Father being Kenyan born and not a US citizen.


Wart

[O.S.O.K.]

Haven't seen that one yet... I thought I was up on this...

It happens to the best of us

[Warthogg]

Ahhh... so if he wasn't born here in one of the States proper... The while he would be a citizen... he would not be "Natural Born"...

However...
"The Constitution does not define the phrase natural-born citizen, and various opinions have been offered over time regarding its precise meaning. The Congressional Research Service has stated that the weight of scholarly legal and historical opinion indicates that the term means one who is entitled under the Constitution or laws of the United States to U.S. citizenship "at birth" or "by birth," including any child born "in" the United States (other than to foreign diplomats serving their country), the children of United States citizens born abroad, and those born abroad of one citizen parent who has met U.S. residency requirements."
-Congressional Research Service. Nov. 14, 2011.

So as long as his mother was a citizen... then he is legit.

Maybe....maybe not.

I've not researched this subject but I do believe there is an old precedent by the Surpremes supporting the doubters.


Wart

[Kadmos]

Maybe....maybe not.

I've not researched this subject but I do believe there is an old precedent by the Surpremes supporting the doubters.


Wart

From the 1870's, based mostly on the fathers citizenship, long before the 19th amendment, and before the 14th had even really been tested by the courts.

It would be like trying to uphold the Dred Scott decision at this point

[Warthogg]

From the 1870's, based mostly on the fathers citizenship, long before the 19th amendment, and before the 14th had even really been tested by the courts.

It would be like trying to uphold the Dred Scott decision at this point

Would that still be valid if Barry's Father was Tu Tu and his Mother a believer in Secular Humanistic Judaism ??


Wart

Alright, ALRIGHT......I was just joking !!

[Shadow Walker]

McCain was most likely born on a U.S. military base in Panama. That is the same as being born in the U.S.A.

My D-I-L was born on a U.S. military base in England. She is considered a natural born U.S. citizen, not a citizen of England.

[El Laton Caliente]

From the 1870's, based mostly on the fathers citizenship, long before the 19th amendment, and before the 14th had even really been tested by the courts.

It would be like trying to uphold the Dred Scott decision at this point

If you check the links I posted, the 1874 case has been used as recently as the 1970's & maybe 1980's for the definition of Natural Born / Native Born Citizen. Apparently it is still valid case law.

The original case was a woman sueing for the right to vote. She lost the case, but in doing so they did define and declare her a Natural Born Citizen.

[Kadmos]

If you check the links I posted, the 1874 case has been used as recently as the 1970's & maybe 1980's for the definition of Natural Born / Native Born Citizen. Apparently it is still valid case law.

The original case was a woman sueing for the right to vote. She lost the case, but in doing so they did define and declare her a Natural Born Citizen.

Some of it is valid case law, some of it has been overruled.

Here essentially was the part you referred to in Minor v. Happersett

“The Constitution does not in words say who shall be natural-born citizens. Resort must be had elsewhere to ascertain that. At common law, with the nomenclature of which the framers of the Constitution were familiar, it was never doubted that all children born in a country of parents who were its citizens became themselves, upon their birth, citizens also. These were natives or natural-born citizens, as distinguished from aliens or foreigners. Some authorities go further and include as citizens children born within the jurisdiction without reference to the citizenship of their parents. As to this class there have been doubts, but never as to the first. For the purposes of this case, it is not necessary to solve these doubts. It is sufficient for everything we have now to consider that all children born of citizen parents within the jurisdiction are themselves citizens. “

This very important question (in bold) was left open. Are children born in the US of non-US citizen parents, in fact citizens of the US?

This question was answered in US v. Wong Kim Ark (1898) stating that citizenship in the US was essentially Jus soli, "right of the soil" that is to say birthright citizenship, kids born here are US citizens (expect in a very few circumstances, such as a child born of foreign diplomats. This of course is why we have "anchor babies".

Just on a common sense argument look at what you are saying, there would be two (at least) types of "born citizens".

Type 1, children born of parents who were both citizens
Type 2. children who were born of only one citizen parent.

If you try to define "natural born" as only the first type you essentially deem not only all children of one non-citizen parent as barred from the presidency, but also all children born of an unknown parent, orphans born in the US of unknown parents, etc.

Further, you not only set up a situation where the candidates birth certificate is in question, but also that of both of their parents.