Quote Originally Posted by Kadmos View Post
I didn't say anything even close to "losses are acceptable"

what I am arguing can be seen in the above post starting with the phrase "I am saying that in many...
You are saying losses are acceptable. "In many cases" does not mean no harm, just harm that may not be measurable by current methods, or harm hidden by psychological defensive mechanisms, or harm not immediately evident in tests and surveys. By saying it's not always "necessarily" harmful, you demean those who've experienced it with no measurable methodology of your own. You have no idea what harm it did cause, no knowledge of what such a person could have achieved in their lifetime without that trauma/those acts perpetrated upon them as children, and any attempt on your part to assert (based on those same studies you dismiss as using terms like "may be", "could have", etc., etc.) are specious at best.

Quote Originally Posted by Kadmos View Post
All kind of things, why it happens, how to stop it, types of propaganda, should 3rd parties get involved. Many many books have been written on the subject and it can get very involved.
Gee, and how many acts of genocide has that staved off...you know...historically? More sophistry.

Quote Originally Posted by Kadmos View Post
I gave two already, adultery and state sponsored execution of mentally defective children. I'm not going to do a detailed list of all possible US crimes cross referenced against crimes in 60 some odd other countries...either write that book yourself or wait for the movie

However, it is worth pointing out that while these two examples are totally legal in the US, there is no country on earth I know of where Honor killing or pedophilia are legal
When was the last prosecution for adultery in the US with a sentence of death?

When was the last mentally defective child put to death in the US?

Spitting on the street is also still illegal in many states, and how often do those prosecutions occur? And in many muslim countries, while honor killing or pedophilia may be considered illegal, how often is it allowed, overlooked, authorities turn and look away as it still meets sharia law? Hell, sex with young boys is not even considered pedophilia in many countries (like Afghanistan) it's simply considered normal...but it sounds like you have no problem with that.

Quote Originally Posted by Kadmos View Post
I suppose, aside from Herodotus, Spinoza, Hume, Nietzsche, anthropologists like Benedict and Westermarck, and more recently neuroscience....you know 2,500+ years of western thought.
Philosophy is a wonderful thing, in the abstract. Again, how many instances can you think of where moral relativist thought has staved off or prevented genocide? On the other hand, the philosophies of such moral relativists as Hitler, Marx, Engels, Lenin and Mao can be directly shown to have resulted in multi-millions of murders and countless examples of genocide...so perhaps you do have a point on the influence of philosophical moral relativism on real harm in the world...

Quote Originally Posted by Kadmos View Post
Nor should you think that even the most extreme normative moral relativist has nothing to base acceptable behaviour on, all I am aware of still base it on actual harm to another.
Define harm. That is the salient point here. Because you, or some egghead, states there "may be no harm" does not make it so.