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Thread: Musings of an old man....

  1. #181
    Team Guns Network Silver 04/2013 alismith's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by N/A View Post
    So, would I assume if light somehow traveled slower leaving the car, then it would appear to reach me slower than it really does? To me, both statements are equally wrong. The speed of light has nothing to do with it; we would see the car reach us when it reaches us.
    There is nothing special about light. People have accepted that the Theory of Relativity has given it magical powers, but all things being relative...it hasn't.

    Your example hasn't answered my question. Adding 100mph to the speed of light wouldn't change anything but the speed of light.

    What is it about light that makes it always at speed C, without regard to the velocity of the mass it originates from?
    I believe there is a simple, physical explanation, and it doesn't depend on "appearances" for an answer. I keep asking simply because I've never seen a logical answer, only answers that light is somehow magical and can do all kinds of miraculous things to keep us in the dark.

    Now, I know it might sound like I'm trying to put you down, or I sound arrogant like I'm smarter than everyone, but neither of those are true. It's just if we are to understand the speed of light, we need to understand light itself.
    The only way I can answer you, even though it sounds stupid, is to say that it is a law of physics that you cannot add to the speed of light. That's one of the things that makes light special.

    As far as seeing the car goes, you see the car because of light reflecting off of it, so therefore the speed of light allows you to see it. Since light is coming at you from the car (allowing you to see it where it is), no matter how fast it's moving, you can't add its speed to the speed of light.
    "Valar morghulis; valar dohaeris."

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  2. #182
    Team GunsNet Silver 12/2011 N/A's Avatar

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    Yes, I know that it is one of the laws of physics that you can't "add to the speed of light". But first, they would need a theory, an explanation, as to why that is. I'm looking to see their theory that leads them to state it is a law.
    I'm not saying light doesn't have a constant speed in a vacuum, I'm saying there has to be a logical reason. Saying light is special isn't the answer.
    Picture in your mind an object moving thru space at 30% of C. It emits a ray of light, and the speed of that ray of light is C. Picture it now...moving thru space and emits light. What special property allows it to not add the velocities together? I'll even allow "relativity/appears" to be used in your answer. You can't say it's "special" or "it's a law of physics". If anyone has a concrete conjecture on why, I'd like to hear it.
    No enemy of America would have ever been killed if they didn't show up to be killed. HDR

  3. #183
    Team GunsNet Silver 12/2011 N/A's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by alismith View Post
    In a way, that's correct. When the light first left Andromeda, the light closer to us would have reached here first, but since the light that reaches us now has had time for the light, from the back of the galaxy has had time to reach us, it looks complete. However, if we could instantly go there, we might see that some of the stars we are able to see from earth have burned out now, and some new stars have already formed.

    Another thing to think about is could quasars be like what you described above, but the light from the backside of the galaxy hasn't had time to reach us yet? In other words, is the quasar just the closest edge of the galaxy's light just reaching us? As time goes on, will they start to appear more galaxy-like to us?

    I think quasars are believed to be the energy and mass that is just starting to form into galaxies....but, who knows for sure?
    I went on line to re-read up on quasars, as there is so much more information easily available now days. I think like you, that quasars are at the beginning formation if galaxies. It being that it is thought that there is a massive black hole at the center of most galaxies, and also at the center of quasars. I'd even wager, that it takes a black hole to have enough gravity to pull enough material together to begin the formation of first quasars, and then enough more to make a galaxy.
    So, on this, I would agree with you on that part.
    No enemy of America would have ever been killed if they didn't show up to be killed. HDR

  4. #184
    Team GunsNet Silver 12/2011 N/A's Avatar

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    http://www.askamathematician.com/201...er-than-light/

    The comments and questions that follow this short article are pretty interesting.

    All I've seen do far is people saying that nothing can go faster than light, and we made up these formulas to prove it's so.

    So, if there was a logical explanation why light speed is always C, and velocities don't add...without needing to make up formulas...then would light lose it's magical properties and not be a barrier, like sound barrier was?
    Last edited by N/A; 09-06-2018 at 11:00 PM.
    No enemy of America would have ever been killed if they didn't show up to be killed. HDR

  5. #185
    Team GunsNet Silver 12/2011 N/A's Avatar

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    How to get to Mars...a proposal.

    https://youtu.be/n9PTH-bvC2k
    No enemy of America would have ever been killed if they didn't show up to be killed. HDR

  6. #186
    Team GunsNet Silver 12/2011 N/A's Avatar

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    A thought occurred to me today; while thinking of something completely different, I realized there is a perfect example of time slowing down when something goes faster. The great thing about it is that it has nothing to do with the. Speed of light, or relativity. It can be shown to happen at speeds as slow as 75-80 mph. Here's how it works.

    Jump in your family vehicle and head out somewhere you need to be in a hurry. No matter how fast you go, there will be a slower vehicle get in front of you. As long as you can not get around them, the miles that are flying by for them, will take hours for you as you look for a chance to pass them up. The faster you try to go, the slower those miles go by. Eventually you will hit a speed barrier that will make the miles stop going by and time comes to a standstill, as you look at those flashing red and blue lights in the rearview.

    And no, those red and blue lights are not Doppler shifted; in fact they are stationary as the outside observer gives you a legal description of your velocity...to give to the judge to see if you win.
    No enemy of America would have ever been killed if they didn't show up to be killed. HDR

  7. #187
    Team Guns Network Silver 04/2013 alismith's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by N/A View Post
    A thought occurred to me today; while thinking of something completely different, I realized there is a perfect example of time slowing down when something goes faster. The great thing about it is that it has nothing to do with the. Speed of light, or relativity. It can be shown to happen at speeds as slow as 75-80 mph. Here's how it works.

    Jump in your family vehicle and head out somewhere you need to be in a hurry. No matter how fast you go, there will be a slower vehicle get in front of you. As long as you can not get around them, the miles that are flying by for them, will take hours for you as you look for a chance to pass them up. The faster you try to go, the slower those miles go by. Eventually you will hit a speed barrier that will make the miles stop going by and time comes to a standstill, as you look at those flashing red and blue lights in the rearview.

    And no, those red and blue lights are not Doppler shifted; in fact they are stationary as the outside observer gives you a legal description of your velocity...to give to the judge to see if you win.
    I concur.
    "Valar morghulis; valar dohaeris."

    "Never say, "gun control" but instead say, "victim disarmament." - L Neil Smith

    Making good people helpless won't make bad people harmless.

    Freedom isn't free.

    "Attitude is the paintbrush that colors our world." TV Series, Haven.

  8. #188
    Senior Member Viking350's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by N/A View Post
    Yes, I know that it is one of the laws of physics that you can't "add to the speed of light". But first, they would need a theory, an explanation, as to why that is. I'm looking to see their theory that leads them to state it is a law.
    I'm not saying light doesn't have a constant speed in a vacuum, I'm saying there has to be a logical reason. Saying light is special isn't the answer.
    Picture in your mind an object moving thru space at 30% of C. It emits a ray of light, and the speed of that ray of light is C. Picture it now...moving thru space and emits light. What special property allows it to not add the velocities together? I'll even allow "relativity/appears" to be used in your answer. You can't say it's "special" or "it's a law of physics". If anyone has a concrete conjecture on why, I'd like to hear it.
    I only understood 1% of this but it may have some of the theoretical and mathematical explanations you seek. https://brilliant.org/wiki/special-relativity/

  9. #189
    Registered User LAGC's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by N/A View Post
    Yes, I know that it is one of the laws of physics that you can't "add to the speed of light". But first, they would need a theory, an explanation, as to why that is. I'm looking to see their theory that leads them to state it is a law.
    The theory is special relativity. According to special relativity, c is the maximum speed at which all conventional matter and hence all known forms of information in the universe can travel. Though this speed is most commonly associated with light, it is in fact the speed at which all massless particles and changes of the associated fields travel in vacuum (including electromagnetic radiation and gravitational waves). Such particles and waves travel at c regardless of the motion of the source or the inertial reference frame of the observer. In the special and general theories of relativity, c interrelates space and time, and also appears in the famous equation of mass–energy equivalence: E = mc2.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_of_light
    "That tyranny has all the vices both of democracy and oligarchy is evident. As of oligarchy so of tyranny, the end is wealth; (for by wealth only can the tyrant maintain either his guard or his luxury). Both mistrust the people, and therefore deprive them of their arms." -- Aristotle, Book V, 350 B.C.E

  10. #190
    Team GunsNet Silver 12/2011 N/A's Avatar

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    Sometimes the use of certain words just grate on my nerves; the worst being the past tense of "plead". Use to be, someone would "plead" guilty/not guilty. After the fact, it would be said they "pled" (past tense) guilty/not guilty. Only uneducated would say some " pleaded"...as past tense. Hearing "pleaded" is like fingernails on a chalkboard. But today it is the acceptable form for the past tense of "plead".

    Please, that's just so wrong. You plead your case, then later you can say you pled your case....not "I pleaded not guilty to the court.".


    Next....
    No enemy of America would have ever been killed if they didn't show up to be killed. HDR

  11. #191
    Team GunsNet Silver 12/2011 N/A's Avatar

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    About the thread about the "probe" coming by the Earth.

    I don't particularly think this particular object is anything more than a "rock", a normal piece of space debris. But what would be so unbelievable if it was a probe? It's not like we don't have two objects traveling out into deep space, that might be found by aliens 50,000 or 100,000 years from now.

    Not all worlds will developer life along the same time line. Life could have started on another world a million years before we did. Maybe they developed intelligent life that was all one race. No black, white, red, brown or yellow "races". Maybe their society by-passed racism and bigotry because everyone was the same. That would have eliminated a lot of what hamstrings humanity.

    Maybe they were more driven to explore, create and expand their intellect than find petty reasons to start wars. If so, they would have more wealth and time to gain space flight than we put into it. There's no reason to assume they couldn't have sent out "probes", like we did hoping that some day in the future another race of beings would find it and know they aren't alone.

    If I were going to send out probes, I'd aim some of them at the center of the galaxy. That's where they will run into the increasing concentration of stars....and planets...and increased odds of intelligent life.
    No enemy of America would have ever been killed if they didn't show up to be killed. HDR

  12. #192
    Team Guns Network Silver 04/2013 alismith's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by N/A View Post
    About the thread about the "probe" coming by the Earth.


    Maybe they were more driven to explore, create and expand their intellect than find petty reasons to start wars. If so, they would have more wealth and time to gain space flight than we put into it. There's no reason to assume they couldn't have sent out "probes", like we did hoping that some day in the future another race of beings would find it and know they aren't alone.
    This TV show kind of explains another reason they might have sent out "probes."

    "Valar morghulis; valar dohaeris."

    "Never say, "gun control" but instead say, "victim disarmament." - L Neil Smith

    Making good people helpless won't make bad people harmless.

    Freedom isn't free.

    "Attitude is the paintbrush that colors our world." TV Series, Haven.

  13. #193
    Team GunsNet Silver 12/2011 N/A's Avatar

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    It appears the only way people are going to get to space is thru private companies, such as Space X. The way they are funded, they can only achieve so much-so fast. If they had more investments...money coming in...they could develop things faster. Not that many people are going to invest in their stock tho, as there is only so much stock available, and once that share of stock is sold, it really doesn't bring anymore money into the company.

    They need a way to get a steady stream of money coming in. I've thought of one way; it might not be practice but I just present it for discussion.

    To buy passage on future space flights is not going to be cheap, not like a bus ride for sure. But what if Space X said they could put a small resort in orbit, and transport people to and from it for a 3 day stay for $65,000.00 each. Then, let people open accounts with Space X and start depositing money into those accounts so they could build up to the total cost.
    The accounts could be transferable to other people if the original so desired.
    Also, the accounts would be non-refundable, as the money would be going to build the infrastructure, I.e. the resort and transport to get to the resort.

    This would infuse money into private enterprise to get it done and give an incentive for people to invest. After all, if you can invest in Bitcoin to hand down to your grandkids, couldn't you invest in a future ticket to Moon Base Alpha for a grandkid to get that job on the Moon?



    Just a thought.
    No enemy of America would have ever been killed if they didn't show up to be killed. HDR

  14. #194
    Team GunsNet Silver 12/2011 N/A's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by alismith View Post
    This TV show kind of explains another reason they might have sent out "probes.
    o]
    Six of one...half dozen of the other.

    "There's a million stories in the naked galaxy; this is one of them."
    No enemy of America would have ever been killed if they didn't show up to be killed. HDR

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