Need advice on brass tumblers

[JTHunter]

Can somebody help with some information about the different types of brass tumblers, rotary and vibratory?
I don't do much brass cleaning at any one time, about 100-150 rd. of .380 or 50-75 .243 in the past. Now I'm adding in .38 Special and .357.
The old way I used to clean brass was to take a plastic 1 gal paint can and fill it 1/2 way with red nutshell media and "borrow" a stores paint shaker for 3-5 minutes. UNFORTUNATELY, all those "exposed paddle" type of machines have disappeared and these newer cube shakers don't rattle the brass as well, so I am looking for a tumbler of some kind.
My questions are:
Which is faster?
Which is quieter?
Which is more mechanically durable?
Which does a better job?
Anything else you can think of that would help would be appreciated.

[dfariswheel]

I haven't reloaded for years but my experience was that rotary drum types are usually quieter, but vibrating types do a better job and are faster.
The vibrating types are also easier to work with since you don't have to open them up to empty and you can just toss more cases in as it's running.
As for durability I have no good feel for that.

My buddy is a heavy reloader of Match ammo and has a number of case cleaning systems and has tried about everything available.

He uses vibrating types usually filled with stainless steel polishing media. This is tiny stick-like pieces of stainless steel that clean and polish. This seems to also clean the primer pockets better then other media.

He tried ultrasonic and didn't like it due to the need of rinsing. He did use it by putting the brass in a plastic net bag and running it in a bigger US cleaner. To dry he'd either put it out on the driveway in the summer sun, or in an oven set on warm. Note that many newer electric ovens only go as low as 200 degrees which is a bit much.

To empty the vibrating cleaners he bought a device from Dillon. Just dump the brass and media into the thing and turn a handle and it separates the brass and media quickly. The brass can be poured into another container and the media back into the cleaner.

Of the polishing media we both tried ground up corncob in our early reloading days.... too much dust and small particles, didn't do a really good job, got dirty and greasy fast, and wore out fast.

Ground walnut hulls with a little red rouge polishing media... works very well but when it's fresh and new the red rouge leaves a light dusting on the brass that if not removed may cause wear of the loading dies and press over time. Also eventually gets dusty and breaks up into small bits. But by that time it's dirty and needs to be replaced.

The stainless steel "pin" media works well but it may lightly dent the case mouths, and on some size cases it may catch in the primer pocket. The light denting of the case mouths is not bad, and not a concern, except he's loading high precision expensive Match conditioned brass.
When it gets dirty just wash it and dry. He puts it in a fine mesh bag and dunks it in a sink full of soapy water. Another plunge into a clean water rinse then dry in an oven or on the driveway.

I settled on a vibrating cleaner with ground walnut and a little red rouge if I really wanted it polished. Polishing really isn't necessary, you just need it to be cleaned.
The noise wasn't a concern since I wasn't married at the time and it's not that loud. Nor did I leave it running long times.

[davepool]

I use a Lyman turbo sonic cleaner to remove all the carbon from the cases and primer pockets then run them through the Lyman vibratory to shine them up. I have a small compressor in my loading room to dry off the cases after rinsing them and blow out the media after shining them up. I just finished processing 600 cases of Lapua 308 this way and in the process of preping 600 6mmBR cases

The turbo sonic will hold 100 308 cases at a time but it only has a 5min. cycle so it has to be reset about 6-7 times to get the brass clean of all carbon, but while that is going on i'm sizing and trimming cases. The tumbler will also hold 100 308 cases and it takes about an hour to shine them up.

I've run over 5000 cases through each of these tools and they're still going.

Prepping cases is the least fun part of re-loading and the time it takes is what it is, but my cases look factory new when it's all done.
It took about three days to size, trim, wash, and polish 600 cases, but at the rate i shoot, that's 2-3 months of ready to load brass

[jet3534]

About a year ago I got an inexpensive ultrasonic cleaner for cleaning gas pistons, AR bolt carrier groups, and the like. I tried cleaning brass in the ultrasonic cleaner using water and a little Simple Green and this approach seem to work better for me than a tumbler and crushed walnut shells. I don't have much need to rinse after the cleaning but this would be easy to do using a bottle of water and a little shaking. My approach is a few minutes in the ultrasonic cleaner and then a few minutes drying with a hair dryer. I have to say my only reload is .45 colt, i.e., 255 grain lead bullet and 8.7 grains of Unique. Unique is a very dirty powder as anyone who has used it will attest.

[JTHunter]

Thanks for your feedback. It is appreciated!
I took the day to do some searching at local stores. One of the largest (local) sporting goods store in the area has apparently gotten rid of a lot of their reloading supplies within the last few months and had no machines.
Checked a local chain store, Rural King as well as another nearby gun store with the same results. Lowe's had no "parts cleaners" either so I didn't bother going to Home Depot.
Harbor Freight has possibilities however. They have two vibratory tumblers as well as two rotary "drum" tumblers. The single & double drum rotary tumblers can only handle 3 lbs. per canister, which eliminated them. The larger vibratory cleaner can hold 18 lbs. which is more than I need. The smaller holds 5 lbs. and is listed for $49.99. My concern is that the motor, being rated at only 0.6 amps, may not be strong enough. OH - the bowl is also polyethylene plastic and not metal.
Academy Sports has two larger type vibratory tumblers, the Hornady M-2 ($59.99) and one from "Franklin Arsenal" for $39.99. The M-2 claims to hold about 400 .38 Special while the Franklin says it holds ~600 9mm. Both are bigger than I need or want but the price on the Franklin is appealing.
That being said, with one of those "20% off" coupons from Harbor Freight, that smaller unit at $49.99 would drop to $39.99, the same price as the Franklin and a more useful size (for me).

Thoughts?

[dfariswheel]

As far as I know all vibratory case cleaners have plastic drums.
A metal drum would be unbearably loud and would probably damage the brass.

Before buying I'd recommend doing some reading and competitive pricing on Amazon and Optics Planet.
The reviews may give you some valuable info.

[JTHunter]

As far as I know all vibratory case cleaners have plastic drums.
A metal drum would be unbearably loud and would probably damage the brass.

Before buying I'd recommend doing some reading and competitive pricing on Amazon and Optics Planet.
The reviews may give you some valuable info.

Good point. That hadn't occurred to me.
I'll check out the reviews at Amazon but I won't ever buy from them. (I don't even pay bills "on-line".)

[JTHunter]

Good grief !!
Amazon has the same 5 lb. tumbler from Harbor Freight but they want $90 for it !!Plus shipping !
Optics Planet only had the large size machines which are larger than I need.
Thanks for the tip dfariswheel. It was good to see some of the other brands, capacities, and prices out there.

[rci2950]

I use the lyman orange vibrating one. I just get the crushed walnut shells from the pet store. Comes in big bags for lizard bedding. Dont use the orange polishing media. It has rouge in it and is a pain in the ass to get off the brass after. It goes all inside and just makes a mess. The clean walnut shells do a good enough job for me. I dont need my brass to be gleaming just clean...

[weevil]

I use a Thumlers Tumbler Model B



I can't stand the racket of vibrators even if they are quicker. I load the tumbler with cases and crushed walnut and let it run overnite. Cases come out shiny and clean the next day.

As for durability I've been using it steady for going on 20 years and it's still going strong. Haven't needed to replace anything. Thought for sure the belt or bushings would wear out but they're just fine after all these years. These things were designed for tumbling rocks for days on end to polish them, so some brass cases and walnut is practically like running empty.

Not cheap though...you're looking at around $200 or so for one. Yeah there are smaller cheaper ones out there but this beast will do anything I could ever want and has lasted for two decades and is still going strong and if it does ever need a part they are all readily available.

[JTHunter]

Thanks Weevil but a 15 lb. capacity is larger than I need. But your tip led me to these.

This place, http://therockshed.com/tumbler2.html, has the AR-2 with two 3 lb. rubber barrels for $124 but only a 1 yr. warranty. The Rock Shed also has Lortone tumblers (http://therockshed.com/tumbler4.html) with the Mod. 33B (two 3 lb. drums), the Mod. 45C (one 4lb. drum) for $115 ea. and the QT6 (one 6 lb. drum) for $169.
Amazon has the Mod. B for $218 and the AR-2 for $148 (?!?!?).
Hay Needle (https://www.hayneedle.com/games-and-...%20b&tid=exact) has the AR-2 for $142.

This is crazy ! I never knew there were so many of these things out there !
Again, thanks for all your tips and leads !!

[weevil]

The main advantage I've found to having a big one is the walnut stays cleaner longer...of course it takes more to fill it.

I originally had one of those small tumblers with the rubber drum when I started, don't remember what brand, not only did I wear it out within a couple years but the walnut had to be changed out every load. This one maybe every 5 or 6 loads sometimes more depending on how nasty of a powder I'm using and how many cases I'm cleaning.

It looked sorta like this one...



Belt was always crapping out luckily there was an electronics store that carried them, then the drum started to split and the lid wouldn't stay on. More of a toy for kids to play with tumbling rocks until they get bored with it or the belt breaks, than a serious tumbler that will hold up for years of use.

The difference between a $50 tumbler and a 200 one.

But it did get me started in the hobby and once I knew it was something I wanted to do for sure I invested in some better quality equipment.



It was REW who recommended the Thumlers as that's what he was using. REW was a big help to me when I was getting started in reloading. He was a great guy...I miss him.

[JTHunter]

Here's a final update on these tumblers.
I ended up getting the smaller tumbler from Harbor Freight as it seemed better suited for my needs. Today, I FINALLY put into action as the temperatures have dropped and I wanted to run it in my outdoor polebarn. I have a 1 gal. plastic paint can about 3/4 full of red nutshell media and I dumped the entire contents into the tumbler with 100 .38 Sp. brass. With the extra weight of the material in the bowl, this thing made even less noise than when it was empty.
The brass wasn't real dirty (except inside) to begin with so I checked it after about 1.5 - 2 hours and it looked good enough. I used an old slotted kitchen spoon to scoop out most of the brass but finally had to dump 3/4 back into the paint can to get the last few pieces out. What took so long was the flash holes in about 95% of the brass had media chips wedged into them. I got a 6" piece of 14 ga. copper wire to pick out the pieces and, while it worked well, it was time consuming.
Here are "Before & After" shots.
Thanks again for all the ideas and advice!!

[alismith]

The "after" cases look like new cases....

[davepool]

Here's a final update on these tumblers.
I ended up getting the smaller tumbler from Harbor Freight as it seemed better suited for my needs. Today, I FINALLY put into action as the temperatures have dropped and I wanted to run it in my outdoor polebarn. I have a 1 gal. plastic paint can about 3/4 full of red nutshell media and I dumped the entire contents into the tumbler with 100 .38 Sp. brass. With the extra weight of the material in the bowl, this thing made even less noise than when it was empty.
The brass wasn't real dirty (except inside) to begin with so I checked it after about 1.5 - 2 hours and it looked good enough. I used an old slotted kitchen spoon to scoop out most of the brass but finally had to dump 3/4 back into the paint can to get the last few pieces out. What took so long was the flash holes in about 95% of the brass had media chips wedged into them. I got a 6" piece of 14 ga. copper wire to pick out the pieces and, while it worked well, it was time consuming.
Here are "Before & After" shots.
Thanks again for all the ideas and advice!!

That's why i have one of those small harbor freight air compressors in my loading room, a quick blast of air through the case neck and all the crap is gone

[weevil]

I use a decapper die for dirty brass because that way I don't get my sizing die filthy from the dirty brass. Then after they're cleaned I run them through the sizer and it cleans out the hole with it's decapper shaft.

Plus the cleaned cases seem to run through the sizer smoother than dirty ones.

[davepool]

I use a decapper die for dirty brass because that way I don't get my sizing die filthy from the dirty brass. Then after they're cleaned I run them through the sizer and it cleans out the hole with it's decapper shaft.

Plus the cleaned cases seem to run through the sizer smoother than dirty ones.

Yep, i used to do that too, now all my dies are titanium and i use sizing wax for lube, the dies get messy but a squirt of wd 40 and blast with the air and i'm back at it in 5 minutes

One thing i've found in all the years of reloading and hanging around benchrest and long range shooters is that there are several ways to accomplish the same goal, we all have our own methods, one of the benchrest guys i know is absolutely anal, i swear he has a voo doo ceremony over his loaded ammo before a match.

On the topic of cleaning brass, i did a test to see how loading dirty brass effected accuracy.
I loaded 20 rounds of once fired.308 lapua cases with a load that shoots 1/4''-1/2'' MOA, and 20 rnds of cleaned cases

The fired cases were neck sized and the primer pockets cleaned
The others neck sized and thoroughly cleaned inside and out

Shot the rounds at 200 yards and there was no major difference in the groups; Uncleaned - .701" for 4- 5 shot grp. avg.
Cleaned - .692"
I did the test again with the dirty twice fired cases and the results were similar, so i don't know if clean brass is so critical to accuracy, but i didn't change the way i prep cases after the test, i just like pretty shiny boollits

[Schuetzenman]

I see you've already purchased something, I'm late to this thread it seems. That said I use a vibratory case polisher from Midway. Been using it since 1997. I often wish it was bigger. I use Walnut media only, it cleans faster. I put Flitz polish in to the Walnut media.