ATF position on pistol grip 'shotguns' creates new danger

[Gunreference1]

David Codrea
Gun Rights Examiner

ATF position on pistol grip 'shotguns' creates new danger

November 15th, 2010 12:13 pm ET

An interpretation by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives that pistol grip shotguns are not shotguns has created an unforeseen legal liability for owners of such firearms. ATF’s Nov. 2009 FFL Newsletter declared:

Certain commercially produced firearms do not fall within the definition of shotgun under the GCA even though they utilize a shotgun shell for ammunition. For example, firearms that come equipped with a pistol grip in place of the buttstock are not shotguns as defined by the GCA.

To read the rest of the story click the link below.

http://www.examiner.com/gun-rights-i...tes-new-danger

Steve

[Moebrown20]

This is from ATF Ruling 95-3 :

(f) Destructive device. --The term "destructive device" means
* * * (2) any type of weapon by whatever name known which will, or
which may be readily converted to, expel a projectile by the action
of an explosive or other propellant, the barrel or barrels of which
have a bore of more than one-half inch in diameter, except a
shotgun or shotgun shell which the Secretary or his delegate finds
is generally recognized as particularly suitable for sporting
purposes . . .'

[imanaknut]

Interesting read and makes me wonder if there will be a major statement from NRA and GOA. As far as I am concerned any object used to destroy something is a destructive device, like a baseball bat, or a golf club, or an automobile, or...

ATF, out of control, and siting an object as being illegal based on an unconstitutional law, the 1968 Lyndon Johnson Gun Control Act, also known by him as step one in taking over the country as it's first dictator. Both the agency and the act need to go.

[Krupski]

This is from ATF Ruling 95-3 :

What, exactly, is a "shotgun"?

I have a Remington 870 with an 18.5 inch barrel. Anyone I know would call it a "shotgun". It's a 12 gauge, so it has a bore over 1/2 inch diameter. It's got a smooth bore barrel and fires "shotshells".

What if I buy a rifled barrel for it to shoot slugs? Is it now a "rifle"? Does this mean the rifled barrel can be 16 inches instead of 18?

If it's a "rifle" with a rifled barrel, then it's illegal because it's got a bore over 1/2 inch diameter.

Hmmm... I'm going in circles here, getting nowhere and now wondering just what the hell IS legal and what isn't...

Fucking BATFE.... idiots.

[imanaknut]

To throw gasoline on the fire, Taurus made the Judge with a rifled barrel so that when firing the .410 shotgun round, you would not be considered having a short barrel shotgun, or worse, a sawed off shotgun since it doesn't have a buttstock.

So if you had a shotgun with a rifled barrel, a 10ga for instance, could you cut it to 16.10"???? And then would ATF consider it an artillery piece since it is over 1/2"???

[aliceinchains]

What, exactly, is a "shotgun"?

I have a Remington 870 with an 18.5 inch barrel. Anyone I know would call it a "shotgun". It's a 12 gauge, so it has a bore over 1/2 inch diameter. It's got a smooth bore barrel and fires "shotshells".

What if I buy a rifled barrel for it to shoot slugs? Is it now a "rifle"? Does this mean the rifled barrel can be 16 inches instead of 18?

If it's a "rifle" with a rifled barrel, then it's illegal because it's got a bore over 1/2 inch diameter.

Hmmm... I'm going in circles here, getting nowhere and now wondering just what the hell IS legal and what isn't...

Fucking BATFE.... idiots.

Good post Krupski.

[raxar]

so if you own a shotty pistol grip and a shotgun are you in "constructive possession"?

[Gunreference1]

Friday, November 19, 2010

"This whole (Pistol Grip Shotgun) Destructive Device issue is easily the hugest single regulatory f-ckup in the history of ATF."



I received this email from a fellow who has studied the internal workings of the ATF for many years:


-----Original Message-----
From: (Redacted)
To: Mike Vanderboegh, et. al. (Redacted)
Sent: Thu, Nov 18, 2010
Subject: SAR and pistol grip shotguns

(Redacted) said somebody told him to check out the latest SAR (Small Arms Review) for some stuff on "Pistol Grip Firearms." From what I can see (attached), the only thing is what amounts to a copy of the 2009 FFL Newsletter information. No analysis, just straight This Is What ATF Says.

This whole Destructive Device issue is easily the hugest single regulatory fuckup in the history of ATF. The only other fuckup that even comes minimally close, and really not hardly at all, is that double-barreled sawed-off shotguns that were at least 12" but less than 18" in length had a $1 transfer tax (rather than $200) from 1938 to 1954 because the language to provide a $1 tax for the Marble's Game Getter Gun included the phrase "two attached barrels," so it by mistake also applied to certain sawed-off shotguns. The Congress let that one rock along for some 16 years. But since there was the registration requirement, which people didn't like, there was probably not wide manufacture of sawed-off shotguns, given the $200 "making" tax and manufacturer's license fees.

To read the rest of the story click the link below.

http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogsp...p-shotgun.html

Steve