Stopping Power and the .455 Webley.

[gunslinger]

I know that stopping power has been debated so much that it's like beating a horse who's been dead so long that barely the bones remain. But there's something that arouses my curiosity and perplexity.
It's the .455 Webley.

The Webley .455 revolver has been proven a very satisfying manstopper in over three quarters of a century of service.
It shoots a godawful chunk of lead, much like a good old catapult, at the speed a good old catapult would be capable of.
265 grains of lead, with a velocity of about 600 fps.
By comparison, the .45 ACP fires a 230 grains bullet (a respectable chunk of lead in itself) at the much more impressing velocity of 830-850 fps.

The contemporary 45 colt fired a 255 bullet up to 1000 fps.

BUT, al three cartridges seemed to perform equally well as for stopping power.

Per se, the 455 is capable of very modest penetration: about 18" in water, equivalent to 9", 10" inches in gelatin. We usually assume that 12" is minimum to get proper stopping power.

None the less, the .455 performed better than the 45 Colt at the Thompson Lagarde tests.


How can this very, very slow bullet, with so little penetration, have such a good stopping power?

Some ventured to say that the bullet's slow speed allowed the target to "feel more" he'd been hit.
Others said that it shattered bones better (and there may be a point here, if we compare this hypothesis with the principle on which the carronade was based: less shot speed, more shattering and splinters, instead of a cleanly cut hole).
Still... I wonder what may be the reason of such good performance.
Any opinions on the subject would be much appreciated.

[mriddick]

I've seen figures that put a 265gr bullet at 700-750fps, which probably puts it on par with the 230gr 45 acp load (820fps)so I can see why it did so well in tests. I have a Webley rechambered to 45acp I shoot std velocity 45acp in quite abit, they are nice shooters.

[O.S.O.K.]

I bet there's no difference in "stopping power" by today's testing/research standards.

The TL testing was great for its time but had a lot of flaws and only tested round nosed bullets - and some were different shapes - the 455's is more conical vs the 45ACP's is almost spherical.

[Richard Simmons]

I wonder if it may have something to do with the caliber of the men of those bygone days more than the caliber of the gun? You always see the movies showing the British commander standing in full view, exposing himself to the enemy fire and taking deliberate, one handed aim at his target. Cool, calm and every bit in charge. Now that may just be the movies but perhaps they did practice and knowing they didn't have 16+ in the gun with 3x as much in mags for rapid reloads, they made every shot a killing shot? Just a thought.

[alismith]

How can this very, very slow bullet, with so little penetration, have such a good stopping power?

I tend to think it has more to do with "shock" value than penetration. While not penetrating very far, they did produce a jolt when they hit. Not many people could ignore something like that once it makes contact.

It's kind of like taking a hammer-hit right in the forehead. While not traveling as fast as a bullet, it produces one hell of a shock when it makes contact...enough to kill from blunt force trauma.

Smaller diameter bullets, traveling at supersonic speeds, tend to penetrate farther but lack the shock value. They may kill, but it may take more than one hit to instantly stop a person. A hammer can stop a person instantly.

[gunslinger]

I wonder if it may have something to do with the caliber of the men of those bygone days more than the caliber of the gun? You always see the movies showing the British commander standing in full view, exposing himself to the enemy fire and taking deliberate, one handed aim at his target. Cool, calm and every bit in charge. Now that may just be the movies but perhaps they did practice and knowing they didn't have 16+ in the gun with 3x as much in mags for rapid reloads, they made every shot a killing shot? Just a thought.

Indeed, I thought about that.
Shot placement seems to be the highest ranking factor in handgun stopping power.

[gpwasr10]

I know that stopping power has been debated so much that it's like beating a horse who's been dead so long that barely the bones remain. But there's something that arouses my curiosity and perplexity.
It's the .455 Webley.

The Webley .455 revolver has been proven a very satisfying manstopper in over three quarters of a century of service.
It shoots a godawful chunk of lead, much like a good old catapult, at the speed a good old catapult would be capable of.
265 grains of lead, with a velocity of about 600 fps.
By comparison, the .45 ACP fires a 230 grains bullet (a respectable chunk of lead in itself) at the much more impressing velocity of 830-850 fps.

The contemporary 45 colt fired a 255 bullet up to 1000 fps.

BUT, al three cartridges seemed to perform equally well as for stopping power.

Per se, the 455 is capable of very modest penetration: about 18" in water, equivalent to 9", 10" inches in gelatin. We usually assume that 12" is minimum to get proper stopping power.

None the less, the .455 performed better than the 45 Colt at the Thompson Lagarde tests.


How can this very, very slow bullet, with so little penetration, have such a good stopping power?

Some ventured to say that the bullet's slow speed allowed the target to "feel more" he'd been hit.
Others said that it shattered bones better (and there may be a point here, if we compare this hypothesis with the principle on which the carronade was based: less shot speed, more shattering and splinters, instead of a cleanly cut hole).
Still... I wonder what may be the reason of such good performance.
Any opinions on the subject would be much appreciated.

I once saw a man hit with a baseball bat... an item with disturbingly little in the way of penetration, and much, much less swift FPS number.

The attack was... stopped... quickly.

The moral of this story, HIT BIG. & find success.